We do have a bunch of clowns in Pa trying to put this together.......but I do think they will try their hardest to get started by Sept after seeing the money brought in by Delaware & NJ from baseball, world cup soccer, etc.....there are lawmakers telling Pa to hurry up & get this rolled out by start of NFL season ......but if it doesn't, the latest will definitely be Oct or Nov.......I do not see Pa missing out on the bowl games & NFL playoffs & SB.
Pa online poker & online casinos will be up & running by Oct to Nov......so I see sports betting around that time as well if not by Sept.
Its certainly unreal how Pa passed legal sports betting last fall but have been twirling their thumbs since......they should have had the regulations & laws written & as soon as PASPA was overturned, should have been ready to go.........it was a cluster f**k from the beginning when put in a $10 million license fee & 36% tax rate, only the highest in the world.......what a joke, but I still think they will get it down with those high fees & taxes......they stated the regulations are temporary which I believe is for 2 years until permanent ones are put in.
At least Delaware is only 1 hour & 15 minutes from me if I ever desire to bet at a sports book.
Pennsylvania would charge a 34 percent tax on a casino’s “daily gross sports wagering revenue” from sports bets. It’s the highest sport betting tax rate in the world, according to casino industry insiders.
Pennsylvania last Thursday opened its application process. By Monday no casinos had filed.
What a joke Pa has become on this issue.......let's see if any casino signs up with these massive license fees & taxes.
Pennsylvania last Thursday opened its application process. By Monday no casinos had filed.
What a joke Pa has become on this issue.......let's see if any casino signs up with these massive license fees & taxes.
they won't. 34% would be the highest betting tax in the world then toss on the $10M license and you're talking about complete insanity. WillHill already laughed them off because they can fire straight up in a border state, NJ, at 9-13% depending on in-person or online wagers. Another border state, WV, will be 10% tax with a $100k 5-year license. They'll just toss their dollars into WV, NJ, DE and give PA the finger
pretty good, and completely biased, take on PA betting regulations.
SO WHAT? THE STATE NEEDS MONEY
Yes, it certainly does. The fact that Pennsylvania has been operating under a budget shortfall is the only reason we even have a sports betting law to pick on.
This is the issue, though. Rather than viewing expanded gambling as an amenity for casinos, the state took it as an opportunity to plug its own leaks. Tax revenue is arguably the worst reason to allow expanded gambling, and that’s especially true for sports betting.
As any bookmaker (or bettor) will tell you, sports gambling has some of the tightest margins in the industry. Although bettors plunked down almost $5 billion last year in Nevada, sportsbooks earned less than $250 million, holding around five percent of the total “handle.”
In simple terms, operators earn about a nickel on every dollar bet. And Pennsylvania will take back almost two cents of that in taxes. That take will be counterproductive to what should have been the primary reason for legalization.
Sports betting is unique in that operators aren’t competing against each other as much as they are competing against offshore sites. There’s something like $150 billion wagered in the US each year, and almost all of it is done through black/gray channels. In order to provide a tempting alternative, the regulated industry must provide similar convenience and competitive lines.
Convenience won’t be a problem as long as there is mobile wagering, but competitive lines might be. If bookmakers want to be profitable in PA, they’ll almost certainly have to pad their lines. And if PA lines aren’t competitive, those in the know will just keep betting with “their guy.”
By writing their greed and shortsightedness into law, PA lawmakers are actually doing the unregulated industry a bit of a favor.
____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
willhill's take on this....
[FONT="]“If you’re paying $10 million up front for the privilege of paying 41 percent in [combined state, local and federal] taxes, plus the infrastructure costs, it’s difficult for me to see how you make money in Pennsylvania,” said Joe Asher, CEO of William Hill US, the largest sports book operation in Nevada. His company is eager to contract with Pennsylvania casinos to run their sports betting operations — it has already made such arrangements in New Jersey — but he is uncertain if the state’s casinos will find it worth their while.[/FONT]
[FONT="]“You can’t run a casino in an underground black market and pay zero taxes, but you can run [an illegal] bookmaking operation that way,” Mr. Asher said. “A bookmaker will be able to offer a 25 percent rebate on losses to his customers and still have an advantage over the legal market.”[/FONT]
SO WHAT? THE STATE NEEDS MONEY
Yes, it certainly does. The fact that Pennsylvania has been operating under a budget shortfall is the only reason we even have a sports betting law to pick on.
This is the issue, though. Rather than viewing expanded gambling as an amenity for casinos, the state took it as an opportunity to plug its own leaks. Tax revenue is arguably the worst reason to allow expanded gambling, and that’s especially true for sports betting.
As any bookmaker (or bettor) will tell you, sports gambling has some of the tightest margins in the industry. Although bettors plunked down almost $5 billion last year in Nevada, sportsbooks earned less than $250 million, holding around five percent of the total “handle.”
In simple terms, operators earn about a nickel on every dollar bet. And Pennsylvania will take back almost two cents of that in taxes. That take will be counterproductive to what should have been the primary reason for legalization.
Sports betting is unique in that operators aren’t competing against each other as much as they are competing against offshore sites. There’s something like $150 billion wagered in the US each year, and almost all of it is done through black/gray channels. In order to provide a tempting alternative, the regulated industry must provide similar convenience and competitive lines.
Convenience won’t be a problem as long as there is mobile wagering, but competitive lines might be. If bookmakers want to be profitable in PA, they’ll almost certainly have to pad their lines. And if PA lines aren’t competitive, those in the know will just keep betting with “their guy.”
By writing their greed and shortsightedness into law, PA lawmakers are actually doing the unregulated industry a bit of a favor.
____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
willhill's take on this....
[FONT="]“If you’re paying $10 million up front for the privilege of paying 41 percent in [combined state, local and federal] taxes, plus the infrastructure costs, it’s difficult for me to see how you make money in Pennsylvania,” said Joe Asher, CEO of William Hill US, the largest sports book operation in Nevada. His company is eager to contract with Pennsylvania casinos to run their sports betting operations — it has already made such arrangements in New Jersey — but he is uncertain if the state’s casinos will find it worth their while.[/FONT]
[FONT="]“You can’t run a casino in an underground black market and pay zero taxes, but you can run [an illegal] bookmaking operation that way,” Mr. Asher said. “A bookmaker will be able to offer a 25 percent rebate on losses to his customers and still have an advantage over the legal market.”[/FONT]
Pennsylvania has 7 pro league teams......the state could be one of the biggest, if not the biggest in bringing in tax revenue off all the bets coming in, but the law makers screwed up badly with their numbers on tax rates, etc......if they did it right, $250,000 for a license fee & a 12% tax rate, they would invite every casino in Pa, & the OTB's, online betting, & whatever else........the more outlets you have, the more tax revenue you acquire.
I agree, I live in Pa & I don't see the casinos signing up with these crazy numbers.
https://www.google.com/amp/www.phil...e-tax-rate-nba-game-3-20180604.html?amphtml=y
Why haven't Pa. casinos filed for sports-betting permission yet? Could be 10 million reasons
Pennsylvania late last week opened the process to allow existing casinos to file for the right to establish sports books. Through the weekend, nobody had jumped, which isn’t surprising given the logistics involved — and what state lawmakers are charging.
The head of William Hill US, which just partnered with the Ocean Resort (formerly Revel) in Atlantic City to run its book, says the company is not making any similar deals in the Keystone State because the law calls for a 36 percent tax on operators’ revenue plus a one-time fee of $10 million. Sounds like the deal Michael Corleone offered Moe Greene in The Godfather
“Pennsylvania is in a different bucket because of the tax rate,” said Joe Asher, William Hill’s chief executive officer, who is from Wilmington and worked as a kid at the old Brandywine racetrack. “We can’t figure it out. Because of it, we haven’t spent the time or effort in Pennsylvania that we have in New Jersey. The tax rate is such a big challenge.”
The lack of movement over the weekend was not surprising to Doug Harbach, spokesman for the Pennsylvania Gaming Control Board. Harbach said the process is open for 120 days. It’s worth noting that the NFL would start on the 98th day of that window (Sept. 6), and college football on the 86th day (Aug. 25).
The board is accepting comments from interested parties until June 15.
“We’re evaluating what to do with sports betting,” Evan Davis, vice president and general counsel for SugarHouse Casino in Fishtown, said last week. “The devil is in the details.”
Meanwhile in New Jersey …
The state took another step toward authorizing sports betting with the approval of bills in Senate and Assembly committees. A final full vote is expected on Thursday, which would result in a bill being sent to Gov. Murphy, who supports sports betting.
Professional leagues testified about their opposition to the measure to lawmakers on Monday. The leagues, fearful of nefarious consequences that wagering could invite, are seeking a piece of the pie. They say an “integrity tax” would help them police unlawful gamblers.
NBA lawyer Dan Spillane contended that sports betting “builds its product entirely on another business, imposes substantial risks on the other business, and requires the other business to spend more to protect itself, all without providing compensation or a voice in how the underlying product is used.”
Rep. Ralph Caputo (D-Essex) fired back: “You guys are in it to make money. This is hypocrisy.”
Caputo was referring to the legal battle the sports leagues waged that eventually were decided in New Jersey’s favor by the U.S. Supreme Court.
“Nine years of fighting the state of New Jersey, and you come here?” Caputo continued. “It’s disgraceful. Just a suggestion: You may want to write a check to the state of New Jersey for $9 million for all the money we lost.”
New Jersey’s tax rate would be 8.5 percent, with an additional tax of 1.25 percent going toward marketing for Atlantic City and another 1.25 percent for race-track communities. Bets made via the Internet would be taxed at 13 percent.
Delaware opening
There will be no live racing at Delaware Park on Tuesday, but there will be some action. The region’s first full sports-betting windows will open for business at 1:30 p.m.
“We’re ready,” Delaware Park president Bill Fasy said. “We’re ready for it to happen.”
Delaware has offered limited NFL parlay wagering since 2009. But now, all bets are allowed. Dover Downs and Harrington Raceway & Casino also will be taking action.
There’s not much on Tuesday’s sports calendar, except for a full baseball schedule. The Phillies will play the Cubs in Chicago at 8 p.m. The NBA and NHL playoff finals will be idle, but lines for their coming games will be posted. Future bets across the sports landscape also will be offered.
The Eagles are 8-1 to win the Super Bowl, 4-1 to win the NFC.
Super Bowl favorites Odds Patriots 6-1 Eagles 8-1 Steelers 10-1 Vikings 10-1 Rams 10-1 Also Cowboys 30-1 Giants 50-1 Redskins 100-1 NFC East Odds Eagles 5-8 Cowboys 5-2 Giants 8-1 Redskins 8-1 NBA stuff
The NBA Finals will move to Cleveland on Wednesday, and Westgate in Las Vegas opened the Warriors as 5-point favorites. That number was down to 4.5 early Monday.
Golden State is up, 2-0, in the series, but is 1-1 against the spread. Both games have gone over, including Game 1, in which the late gaffe by the Cavaliers’ J.R. Smith helped the over to hit rather comfortably. It was a monumental backdoor cover – or a bad loss, if you had the under.
The total was 217.5, and Smith’s mistake led to overtime with the score tied at 107. The Warriors outscored Cleveland, 17-7, in OT to win, 124-114. They got the over, but Cleveland still managed to cover the 13-point spread.
The over/under for Wednesday’s Game 3 is again 217.5.
Why haven't Pa. casinos filed for sports-betting permission yet? Could be 10 million reasons
Pennsylvania late last week opened the process to allow existing casinos to file for the right to establish sports books. Through the weekend, nobody had jumped, which isn’t surprising given the logistics involved — and what state lawmakers are charging.
The head of William Hill US, which just partnered with the Ocean Resort (formerly Revel) in Atlantic City to run its book, says the company is not making any similar deals in the Keystone State because the law calls for a 36 percent tax on operators’ revenue plus a one-time fee of $10 million. Sounds like the deal Michael Corleone offered Moe Greene in The Godfather
“Pennsylvania is in a different bucket because of the tax rate,” said Joe Asher, William Hill’s chief executive officer, who is from Wilmington and worked as a kid at the old Brandywine racetrack. “We can’t figure it out. Because of it, we haven’t spent the time or effort in Pennsylvania that we have in New Jersey. The tax rate is such a big challenge.”
The lack of movement over the weekend was not surprising to Doug Harbach, spokesman for the Pennsylvania Gaming Control Board. Harbach said the process is open for 120 days. It’s worth noting that the NFL would start on the 98th day of that window (Sept. 6), and college football on the 86th day (Aug. 25).
The board is accepting comments from interested parties until June 15.
“We’re evaluating what to do with sports betting,” Evan Davis, vice president and general counsel for SugarHouse Casino in Fishtown, said last week. “The devil is in the details.”
Meanwhile in New Jersey …
The state took another step toward authorizing sports betting with the approval of bills in Senate and Assembly committees. A final full vote is expected on Thursday, which would result in a bill being sent to Gov. Murphy, who supports sports betting.
Professional leagues testified about their opposition to the measure to lawmakers on Monday. The leagues, fearful of nefarious consequences that wagering could invite, are seeking a piece of the pie. They say an “integrity tax” would help them police unlawful gamblers.
NBA lawyer Dan Spillane contended that sports betting “builds its product entirely on another business, imposes substantial risks on the other business, and requires the other business to spend more to protect itself, all without providing compensation or a voice in how the underlying product is used.”
Rep. Ralph Caputo (D-Essex) fired back: “You guys are in it to make money. This is hypocrisy.”
Caputo was referring to the legal battle the sports leagues waged that eventually were decided in New Jersey’s favor by the U.S. Supreme Court.
“Nine years of fighting the state of New Jersey, and you come here?” Caputo continued. “It’s disgraceful. Just a suggestion: You may want to write a check to the state of New Jersey for $9 million for all the money we lost.”
New Jersey’s tax rate would be 8.5 percent, with an additional tax of 1.25 percent going toward marketing for Atlantic City and another 1.25 percent for race-track communities. Bets made via the Internet would be taxed at 13 percent.
Delaware opening
There will be no live racing at Delaware Park on Tuesday, but there will be some action. The region’s first full sports-betting windows will open for business at 1:30 p.m.
“We’re ready,” Delaware Park president Bill Fasy said. “We’re ready for it to happen.”
Delaware has offered limited NFL parlay wagering since 2009. But now, all bets are allowed. Dover Downs and Harrington Raceway & Casino also will be taking action.
There’s not much on Tuesday’s sports calendar, except for a full baseball schedule. The Phillies will play the Cubs in Chicago at 8 p.m. The NBA and NHL playoff finals will be idle, but lines for their coming games will be posted. Future bets across the sports landscape also will be offered.
The Eagles are 8-1 to win the Super Bowl, 4-1 to win the NFC.
Super Bowl favorites Odds Patriots 6-1 Eagles 8-1 Steelers 10-1 Vikings 10-1 Rams 10-1 Also Cowboys 30-1 Giants 50-1 Redskins 100-1 NFC East Odds Eagles 5-8 Cowboys 5-2 Giants 8-1 Redskins 8-1 NBA stuff
The NBA Finals will move to Cleveland on Wednesday, and Westgate in Las Vegas opened the Warriors as 5-point favorites. That number was down to 4.5 early Monday.
Golden State is up, 2-0, in the series, but is 1-1 against the spread. Both games have gone over, including Game 1, in which the late gaffe by the Cavaliers’ J.R. Smith helped the over to hit rather comfortably. It was a monumental backdoor cover – or a bad loss, if you had the under.
The total was 217.5, and Smith’s mistake led to overtime with the score tied at 107. The Warriors outscored Cleveland, 17-7, in OT to win, 124-114. They got the over, but Cleveland still managed to cover the 13-point spread.
The over/under for Wednesday’s Game 3 is again 217.5.
Yeah, I can't understand what they were thinking when they came up with those numbers except for greediness w/o thinking how the business model will work.
Unless Pa lower the numbers, I don't see Pa getting sports betting & they will miss out big time with 7 pro teams in Pa & plenty of people ready to bet legally.....they really screwed up & will be watching NJ & other states making money during football season while they're missing out.
People will still keep their Pa locals, but there are times where we want to collect our money right after the game is over. There are times where if you want to bet your local team, the line is out if sack with local guy.......but unless the Pa lawmakers lower the license fee & tax rate, this won't work.
Pa has the highest slot tax rate & the money is coming in like crazy, & they looked at that & thought, they could do it with sports betting, but that's not reality, can't be done unless the state govt want to run the sports books themselves
