Let's get into it... the Confederate Flag.....

[SgtLanquel]

And if you don't think it's ok?

Same as the other items on the long list (we all have such a list) of "things we don't think are OK".

MYOFB

The greatest impediment to any of us realizing our fullest potential in life is the moments (hours/days/years) we spend taking the inventory of other people's choices

When you honestly take your mind off other people's business and focus instead only on your own thinking and your own behaviors, there is an incredible increase in personal power

 

[SgtLanquel]

Nothing more obscene than war? Huh, ok. How about the rape and murder of a child?

For most of us there is probably a line where any number of heinous acts all kind of tie for level of obscenity. (Remember, we each have such a list)

As someone who views the murderous bombing of civilian populations as pretty much equally heinous with rape and murder of a child, I can't imagine ever trying to "Rank" one over the other

Your own list of obscene actions may well be different and though it took me a while to snap to it, It's none of my business what's on your list

All that matters is my own list - so I have made a personal commitment to never rape/murder a child, nor commit violent acts against anyone, anywhere

I am sure you too can exercise such personal discretion with regard to your own list

 

[akphidelt]

It's obvious that your almost tormented by that your fairy tale version of the War is based on so many falsehoods.
How are these blacks victims? How were they “forced” to fight for the South? Imagine a soldier who was forced to fight and was captured by the opposing forces-- under what circumstances would that soldier escape from the “liberators” and make his way back through two lines of armed soldiers, ready to fire at a moment’s notice? To escape back to the very forces who had forced him to fight in the first place, their army unit. This does not strike me as the action of someone who has been forced to fight.

It's not a fairy tale at all. You can read exactly what the Confederate states wrote at that time as to why they were seceding and wanting to go to war with the real United States. There is no secret mystery to it, the blacks in the south were not fighting for the right to continue being owned like property, and the south was not fighting for anything other than the right to pursue their interest in keeping blacks as their free laborers. All from a perspective that blacks were beneath them and unequal to whites and it was their right to own blacks and that blacks were considered their property, so if the north would not give back fugitive slaves they were stealing their property. It was one of the more racist agendas in the history of the United States. You can remember the fallen that fought but glorify them as "heroes" or whatever you want to do is downright disgusting. What they were fighting for is utterly disgusting. Owning human beings is kind of demented.

 

[Enfuego]

For most of us there is probably a line where any number of heinous acts all kind of tie for level of obscenity. (Remember, we each have such a list)

As someone who views the murderous bombing of civilian populations as pretty much equally heinous with rape and murder of a child, I can't imagine ever trying to "Rank" one over the other

Your own list of obscene actions may well be different and though it took me a while to snap to it, It's none of my business what's on your list

All that matters is my own list - so I have made a personal commitment to never rape/murder a child, nor commit violent acts against anyone, anywhere

I am sure you too can exercise such personal discretion with regard to your own list

Until you stop posting as Barman's ghost, I won't acknowledge a thing you have to say.

 

[pocketrockets]

For most of us there is probably a line where any number of heinous acts all kind of tie for level of obscenity. (Remember, we each have such a list)

As someone who views the murderous bombing of civilian populations as pretty much equally heinous with rape and murder of a child, I can't imagine ever trying to "Rank" one over the other

Your own list of obscene actions may well be different and though it took me a while to snap to it, It's none of my business what's on your list

All that matters is my own list - so I have made a personal commitment to never rape/murder a child, nor commit violent acts against anyone, anywhere

I am sure you too can exercise such personal discretion with regard to your own list

+1

Some people will say and rank anything just to have their opinions validated, in this case, a hate opinion.

 

[pocketrockets]

Well, that's where you and others disagree (not me as I'm not a religious guy). I mean, others such as FZ, feel it's one of the worst sins imaginable and when they see it out in public in front of their kids, they have a problem with it.

Nothing more obscene than war? Huh, ok. How about the rape and murder of a child?

See, this is what makes me sad... I know FZ is a good guy and very smart... yet his beliefs get the best of him sometimes (And I really dont have a problem with religious people, I was raised catholic). A religion or a God that teaches hate instead of love and acceptance is not my God, I'm sorry man but I'm already busy disliking people who have personally wronged me, I don't have spare time to be hating people who I never met, just because they have different sexual preferences than myself.

What's your point about comparing war to a kid being raped and murdered? Both are crimes against humanity, there is no ranking there, they are equally disgusting. I know you are a veteran and I respect that a lot, nothing teaches you more discipline than the army, and will ultimately make you a better human being (that of course if you are not too fucked up by trauma and PTSD to enjoy life).

We all have different sexual preferences... my ideal sex setup would be 3-4 girls and 3-4 8balls... involves lots of positions and acts that are illegal in some states... I'm not gay, not even close, FZ might not view my sex life as optimal due to religious beliefs but he wouldn't discriminate me I think.

 

[Enfuego]

See, this is what makes me sad... I know FZ is a good guy and very smart... yet his beliefs get the best of him sometimes (And I really dont have a problem with religious people, I was raised catholic). A religion or a God that teaches hate instead of love and acceptance is not my God, I'm sorry man but I'm already busy disliking people who have personally wronged me, I don't have spare time to be hating people who I never met, just because they have different sexual preferences than myself.

What's your point about comparing war to a kid being raped and murdered? Both are crimes against humanity, there is no ranking there, they are equally disgusting. I know you are a veteran and I respect that a lot, nothing teaches you more discipline than the army, and will ultimately make you a better human being (that of course if you are not too fucked up by trauma and PTSD to enjoy life).

We all have different sexual preferences... my ideal sex setup would be 3-4 girls and 3-4 8balls... involves lots of positions and acts that are illegal in some states... I'm not gay, not even close, FZ might not view my sex life as optimal due to religious beliefs but he wouldn't discriminate me I think.

War is a crime against humanity huh? Just don't know what to say really.

 

[pocketrockets]

War is a crime against humanity huh? Just don't know what to say really.

It is man, there are hardly any winners with war but goverment elite and banks that give loans for said wars. You are very naive if you think otherwise.

Hey, I know peace, love and understanding is Utopia but... war is fucked up... I admit I'm far from being a treehugging hippie, sometimes if I'm in one of my moods I just want to tear someone apart but the fact I experience violent impulses don't make it right.

 

[wilbur]

It is man, there are hardly any winners with war but goverment elite and banks that give loans for said wars. You are very naive if you think otherwise.

Hey, I know peace, love and understanding is Utopia but... war is fucked up... I admit I'm far from being a treehugging hippie, sometimes if I'm in one of my moods I just want to tear someone apart but the fact I experience violent impulses don't make it right.

Good post Pockets

 

[neverbend]

It's not a fairy tale at all. You can read exactly what the Confederate states wrote at that time as to why they were seceding and wanting to go to war with the real United States. There is no secret mystery to it, the blacks in the south were not fighting for the right to continue being owned like property, and the south was not fighting for anything other than the right to pursue their interest in keeping blacks as their free laborers. All from a perspective that blacks were beneath them and unequal to whites and it was their right to own blacks and that blacks were considered their property, so if the north would not give back fugitive slaves they were stealing their property. It was one of the more racist agendas in the history of the United States. You can remember the fallen that fought but glorify them as "heroes" or whatever you want to do is downright disgusting. What they were fighting for is utterly disgusting. Owning human beings is kind of demented.

News Flash! The South Seceded & therefore Lincoln decided upon 'The War of Northern Aggression' The war was iniated
'To keep the Country Whole' as he stated. It wasn't until 1 1/2 later that he issued the 'Emancipation Proclimation' then the
war became about slavery. Most of the Union Army at the time wasn't happy about his Proclamation & the Union Armies were
definitely losing the war to the amazement of the entire world at that time.

 

[Enfuego]

It is man, there are hardly any winners with war but goverment elite and banks that give loans for said wars. You are very naive if you think otherwise.

Hey, I know peace, love and understanding is Utopia but... war is fucked up... I admit I'm far from being a treehugging hippie, sometimes if I'm in one of my moods I just want to tear someone apart but the fact I experience violent impulses don't make it right.

Saying there are no winners in war and calling it a crime against humanity are very very different things. Why is it a crime against humanity to defend your homeland?

 

[pocketrockets]

Saying there are no winners in war and calling it a crime against humanity are very very different things. Why is it a crime against humanity to defend your homeland?

Ok bro, ty for saying that 'cause that's not what I meant.

Is not a crime against humanity, that you, a loyal American, decide to defend your country for whatever reasons you have, I bet those are honorable BUT the government lying to profit from war IS A CRIME. Governments, royalty and what not sending 100s of thousands of their fellow country men to die for "the country" when in reality is for the benefit of the filthy few, the 1%ers if you wish. You are not the criminal, but another victim of the media machine that convinced us of immediate threats were there are only waves and howling. I for one, believe our current governments are rotten to the bone, it wasn't always that way, and let's hope is not always this way.

In the end, all that matters for these people is power and wealth. Human lives are always meaningless compared to owning a new country or profiting billions in a single war contract.

I would fight for my country, if it was invaded, NO DOUBT. I would fight for my family, if it was insulted and menaced, NO DOUBT. War itself is a crime, wanting to fight a war for wealth and power is inmoral. Fighting in a war becuase you fear for your country and the lives of your loved ones can never be inmoral. It's the reason that turns a honorable act inmoral.

There are LOTS of types of soldiers (you know this better than me) and while most are straight arrows, some evil men always slide throught the cracks and that's when we have stuff like Abu Ghraib.

 

[Enfuego]

Ok bro, ty for saying that 'cause that's not what I meant.

Is not a crime against humanity, that you, a loyal American, decide to defend your country for whatever reasons you have, I bet those are honorable BUT the government lying to profit from war IS A CRIME. Governments, royalty and what not sending 100s of thousands of their fellow country men to die for "the country" when in reality is for the benefit of the filthy few, the 1%ers if you wish. You are not the criminal, but another victim of the media machine that convinced us of immediate threats were there are only waves and howling. I for one, believe our current governments are rotten to the bone, it wasn't always that way, and let's hope is not always this way.

In the ends, all that matters for these people is power and wealth. Human lives are always meaningless compared to owning a new country or profiting billions in a single war contract.

I would fight for my country, if it was invaded, NO DOUBT. I would fight for my family, if it was insulted and menaced, NO DOUBT. War itself is a crime, wanting to fight a war for wealth and power is inmoral. Fighting in a war becuase you fear for your country and the lives of your loved ones can never be inmoral. It's the reason that turns a honorable act inmoral.

Wht don't you just quit wasting my time and say what you mean? It's easy. Say IRAQ. Not hard.

 

[VIEJODINOSAUR]

VD, serious question for you. If you are a straight male with little kids and believe that marriage is between a man and a woman, would you find it inappropriate for two dudes to be making out in front of your kids? Curious to hear your opinion.

Not inappropriate.....you can't convince me that marriage is always between a man and a woman.....there are other scenarios out there that are more disturbing than two males making out with each other.....

 

[pocketrockets]

Wht don't you just quit wasting my time and say what you mean? It's easy. Say IRAQ. Not hard.

Because is not my point man. Just pointing an example. My rant is not an anti-american rant is an anti-war rant. Just like sometimes you gotta fight cause you have no choice, there are necessary wars. Iraq not one of them, and thats my very personal opinion but is not my point. Sorry to see you think I'm wasting your time. I was actually try to engage with someone that thinks differently in a civilized manner.

 

[Enfuego]

Not inappropriate.....you can't convince me that marriage is always between a man and a woman.....there are other scenarios out there that are more disturbing than two males making out with each other.....

Thanks for the response.

 

[Enfuego]

Because is not my point man. Just pointing an example. My rant is not an anti-american rant is an anti-war rant. Just like sometimes you gotta fight cause you have no choice, there are necessary wars. Iraq not one of them, and thats my very personal opinion but is not my point. Sorry to see you think I'm wasting your time. I was actually try to engage with someone that thinks differently in a civilized manner.

I really don't understand your point. How is defending your homeland against an aggressor a crime against humanity? You said war is a crime against humanity. If the Chinese came at the U.S. right now, is that a crime against humanity? Simple question.

 

[pocketrockets]

I really don't understand your point. How is defending your homeland against an aggressor a crime against humanity? You said war is a crime against humanity. If the Chinese came at the U.S. right now, is that a crime against humanity? Simple question.

Yes of course it would be a crime. Just like if the US went in now to invade and kill chinamen. No difference whatsoever, not when unprovoked.

 

[pocketrockets]

I really don't understand your point. How is defending your homeland against an aggressor a crime against humanity? You said war is a crime against humanity. If the Chinese came at the U.S. right now, is that a crime against humanity? Simple question.

And I feel I explained myself well on post #92. Fighting a provoked war for the honor of your homeland or family is not a crime, but sending troops to bleed for power and $ is. There is a big difference.

 

[HarryCaray]

the south was not fighting for anything other than the right to pursue their interest in keeping blacks as their free laborers.

Wow, how predictably ignorant.