BetOnSports (BOS) Issue

wilheim · May 27, 2006

Mr. Smith.

I am going to get a definitve ruling on what wagers (if any) can be cancelled at BOS. The bad line policy is another issue and not relative to this cancelled wise guy bet issue.

I will post BOS policy regarding bad lines for everyone to see - so there is no mistake regarding their policy on bad lines.

wil.

Mr.Smith · May 27, 2006

Budworth22 said:
Mr. Smith,

your argument is flawed, as you fail to establish that they can judge any wager to be steam.

????

re-read 1) in the original post. according to their line manager they can judge any wager to be steam.

I dont have to "establish" anything. They already have.

Budworth22 · May 27, 2006

I respect Ladeda, but that doesn't mean that they can judge any wager to be steam.

TomorrowsNewspaper · May 27, 2006

This is disturbing. A couple of weeks ago when I opened my account I placed an incorrect wager. I wanted an over/under but clicked on the +1.5/-1.5 by accident. Not realizing until after I confirmed, I got on the phone to see about changing it. They told me that since the line I get changed I could not cancel the bet. I understood since it was my error and let the bet stand. Now they say if the line changes in your favor (steam), they are going to cancel the wager???? So I guess that means they will only cancel wagers that favor them?????

This is a very bad situation. Too bad, thought they were turning the corner.

tn

gbogo · May 27, 2006

tn thats the point

its a contract that is breakable by them at any point - of their choosing - thats not want an honest bookmaker does

CoachLT · May 27, 2006

If any ONE of these issues are correct, anyone that plays at BOS should be:nohead: This is CRAZY! There are hundreds of books that are better if this BS is allowed to continue. I have an acct at SIA and have NEVER been treated like this. If you play at BOS, you play at your own peril. You have been warned. LT

ucking: :realtongu :realtongu :nohead:

Orangemen · May 27, 2006

A couple sundays ago I wanted to bet hudson and the braves and they had the line at -200 when every other book had it at -125. I called them asked if it was a mistake and they said no. The best part the other team was +110 so they had a 90cent vig. It was 10mts befor gametime so i had no time to move money out so i took the r/l for-125. Needless to say braves won 2-1.

This book is pathetic and I think therx loses alot of respect for backing this book. I know i no longer rely on therx to find good books anymore.

beetman · May 27, 2006

I think it's awful that books like these will put up odds with a horrible vig (the cancelled Western Conference futures recently mentioned from BetOnSports had a 17% hold on a 4 way market!), but the minute they think you have an edge against them, they go out of their way to screw you.

That "steam bet" issue with some books particularly irritates me. I'm a small time bettor--most of my bets are for a couple hundred, and a nickel is a big bet for me. At that level it's not worth my money to subscribe to Don Best or any similar services. When I want to place a bet, I check all my books and place my bet at the book that has the best number. Simple, right? But I've already had a couple books take action against me, in some cases outright booting me, because they accused me of "betting steam." That's incredibly insulting to the bettor--what am I supposed to do when I check my books and see the best line at their shop, sit there with my thumb up my ass and bet it at a different book who's line is 5 cents worse?

wilheim · May 27, 2006

So, here are some facts about BOS according to their line manager...

1) they can cancel your wager anytime after you bet it if they deem it a steam play

2) players can cancel any wagers they made up until the start of the game

I just got off the phone with Jamie Owen at BOS and he assures me no wagers will be cancelled unless they are at an obvious bad line (Eg. Yanks +300 when should be Yanks -300). Players that are identified as steam players over a period of time by risk management will be refunded balances after all pending wagers are graded (futures will also be honored). This is not new policy at BOS and has been in place for a long time. Many other books do the very same thing.

I think the line manager last night used unfortunate terminology when he said he would cancel wagers deemed to be steam. Bottom line is NO WAGERS will be cancelled after they have been made (at fair prices) unless the player himself asks for the bet to be cancelled. As far as that goes: players cannot cancel wagers at will - BOS will work with clients who make mistakes and try to cancel a wager placed in error. I know this depends on what happend to the line in the meantime.

Anyone who ever needs information about BOS policy is free to call Jamie during normal business hours at:

Jamie Owen
Customer Service Manager
BETonSPORTS PLC
1-888-999-2387 Ext 2650
jamie@betonsports.co.cr

Also feel free to email me at wilheim@therx.com if you ever have a problem with BOS.

Thanks, wil..

CoachLT · May 27, 2006

Cowboys, if you don't move your herd to a new grazing site so the wolf doesn't get you, you only have yourself to blame. Many and more highly rated places to graze. LT:money8:

Fishhead · May 27, 2006

Coach LT said:
Cowboys, if you don't move your herd to a new grazing site so the wolf doesn't get you, you only have yourself to blame. Many and more highly rated places to graze. LT:money8:

GATOR-

See Wils last post.

Thanks,
FH

Ladeda · May 27, 2006

Ok, thanks Wil.

At first I thought it was just a manager "talking tough" last night. That is why I called again this morning. He stated the same thing over and over about cancelling the wagers this morning. I even told him I would post what he was telling me here and he didn't care.

I just wanted to clear this up and I'm happy there is some backround on the situation now. I suppose it worked out fine in that the manager said some stupid things and then I posted so BOS looked pretty stupid.

While I was on the phone I asked if they didn't want me business and they didn't say they wanted me out, just that they didn't want me to bet steam. So I guess I'll just play as normal and hope I don't get booted for betting steam. I just didn't want to place any bets after they told me they would cancel the wagers if they thought it was steam. I feel safer now that this is clear.

BOS cost themselves about $1000 on this as I was gonna bet the PHX over at 201 when other books had 202 right before the game. But because of this situation I held back. That is the thing about steam, I really don't know what a steam play is unless it is blatantly obvious. As I found out the steam was on the under last night across the street. I was just going to play the BOS 201 because it was the best price. That was not a scalp, just a straight bet.

wilheim · May 27, 2006

Ladeda, not just talking about BOS here but in my experience many line managers make poor customer service reps when it comes to speaking directly with players. I know there is a sort of paranoia that exists between many line managers and their players regarding steam which unfortunately effects many innocent players who just happen to be decent handicappers or accidently on the side of steam more often than not.

I wish I knew the solution to this problem. Some will say well let the book take all wagers and move the line after. I guess this makes sense but on the other hand books today are in a very competitive enviornment and have the right to take whatever risk management measures they feel is necessary to stay profitable. Lest we forget - all these books (and The Rx.) are in business to make money.

No one is forcing anyone to play at any particular book (advertiser or not) here at The Rx. but at least in the case of BOS there is a very open channel of communication in which Rx. moderators are able to deal with problems promptly and professionally. Rxers that don't like BOS should not play there - others find value there and continue to use the book as part of their arsenal.

Thanks, wil..

Fishhead · May 27, 2006

wilheim said:
Ladeda, not just talking about BOS here but in my experience many line managers make poor customer service reps when it comes to speaking directly with players. I know there is a sort of paranoia that exists between many line managers and their players regarding steam which unfortunately effects many innocent players who just happen to be decent handicappers or accidently on the side of steam more often than not.

I wish I knew the solution to this problem. Some will say well let the book take all wagers and move the line after. I guess this makes sense but on the other hand books today are in a very competitive enviornment and have the right to take whatever risk management measures they feel is necessary to stay profitable. Lest we forget - all these books (and The Rx.) are in business to make money.

No one is forcing anyone to play at any particular book (advertiser or not) here at The Rx. but at least in the case of BOS there is a very open channel of communication in which Rx. moderators are able to deal with problems promptly and professionally. Rxers that don't like BOS should not play there - others find value there and continue to use the book as part of their arsenal.

Thanks, wil..

Well said Wilheim.

queposkid · May 27, 2006

Line managers on the phone with a customer can spell problem..Not all the time, but during rushes its tough to be CS friendly..BOS for years has been about chasing anyone with the advantage, so this comes as no surprise..There are enough options in the market..BOS solid book, but for the above average player, not the best of outs..

CoachLT · May 27, 2006

Fishhead said:
GATOR-

See Wils last post.

Thanks,
FH

Fish, "Caveat Emptor" or Buyer Beware. The RX tries to protect the Newbies from touts yet fall way short in other issues. I know the RX needs the income, so Buyer Beware is all I am saying. Sorry for being a dick but I feel real strongly about books that are not satisfied with beating 95% of their customers. Do we ever hear these complaints about Pinny, Olympic, Cascade, or Cris? I rest my case, the evidence speaks for itself. LT

wilheim · May 27, 2006

The RX tries to protect the Newbies from touts yet fall way short in other issues.

That is what i figured this was about - touts - touts - touts..

It never ends.

wil..

Budworth22 · May 27, 2006

LT, we DO hear complaints abut Oly and Cris, as both are absolute shit 50% of the year (baseball season).

CoachLT · May 27, 2006

wilheim said:
That is what i figured this was about - touts - touts - touts..

It never ends.

wil..

Wil, you ALMOST made me :lolBIG: But I know this is a serious issue and your hands are some what tied in BOTH issues. I will stop beating the drums and let whatever happens happen. Please don't take this personal because it is not. I really do appreciate what you do here. Love ya, LT :103631605