You Guys Miss Me? I've Been in Jail for Anti-Semitism. But Seriously ...

Phaedrus · Jun 27, 2003

I learned a new thing today while on my crawlings ... did you know that it is a violation of federal law for a company to tell you whether or not a product it sells was made in or purchased from Israel? And further, if you or anyone asks such a question, that company is required under federal law to report the "incident" to the government?

Holy shit. It is not often that the for the most part predctable Leviathan State takes me by suprise, but I honestly have to admit that this one really was a curve ball for old Phaedrus.

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North Kansas City Company Settles Charge Related to Boycott of Israel
by Dan Margolies
Kansas City Star

June 25, 2003

Cook Composites and Polymers Co. has agreed to pay a $6,000 fine to settle charges that it violated Commerce Department regulations aimed at countering the Arab boycott of Israel.

The department's Bureau of Industry and Security had charged that, in response to a request from a customer in Bahrain, Cook had furnished information stating that the goods being shipped were not of Israeli origin and did not contain Israeli materials.

The bureau also charged that Cook had failed to report its receipt of the request.

Cook, of North Kansas City, neither admitted nor denied the allegations, but agreed to pay the $6,000 civil penalty.

The antiboycott provisions bar U.S. companies from providing information about their business relationships with Israel. They also require that receipt of boycott requests be reported to the Bureau of Industry and Security, formerly known as the Bureau of Export Administration.

Cook's chief executive, Charles Bennett, was in Paris this week and unavailable for comment. A spokeswoman for the company, Rita Durocher, said the fine marked the first time Cook has had a run-in with a federal agency.

"If you go back and look at our record, we've been flawless with other government agencies," she said.

Cook makes polyester gels and other coating resins. It operates plants throughout North America.

The settlement with the Commerce Department came after the Bush administration in November warned U.S. companies not to heed calls to boycott Israeli goods and services. The warning followed a call by the 22-member Arab League to reactivate its decades-long boycott of Israel.

In a statement released at the time by the department, Commerce Undersecretary for Industry and Security Kenneth Juster reminded American companies that the "U.S. government is strongly opposed to restrictive trade practices or boycotts targeted against Israel."

Knowing violators of the anti-boycott provisions face fines of up to $50,000, or five times the value of the exports at issue, and possible imprisonment. Offenders can also be denied export privileges.

The Bureau of Industry and Security says it has imposed more than $26 million in fines for violations of the provisions.

More than a decade ago, the Commerce Department sent compliance officers to Kansas City to check out tips that Marion Merrell Dow Inc. and Marley Cooling Tower Co. may have cooperated with the Arab boycott. Nothing came of the investigation, and no penalties were imposed.

In Cook's case, the Bureau of Industry and Security charged that Cook failed to report a letter of credit it received on Dec. 1, 1997, from ABN AMRO Bank in Manama, Bahrain. The letter asked it to confirm that the goods being shipped "are not of Israeli origin nor do they contain any Israeli"material.

The bureau also charged that on Jan. 20, 1998, Cook, through its freight forwarder, provided a U.S. bank with a copy of a commercial invoice confirming that the goods were not of Israeli origin and did not contain Israeli material.

Cook, with 558 employees overall and 120 employees locally, is one of North Kansas City's biggest employers. The company bills itself as the No. 1 producer of gel coats in the world and, together with affiliated companies, the No. 2 producer of resins.

Since 1990, Cook has had a joint venture relationship with the chemicals division of TotalFinaElf, a multibillion-dollar petrochemicals giant based in Paris.

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My God, Israel makes me want to puke. Contrary to what the hysterical often say about me, I have nothing against Jewsih people qua their heritage or any nonsensical collectivist notions the likes of which form the bedrock of racism. It is the Pavlovian, p.c. response to accuse anyone opposed to the nature of US-Israeli relations to automatically brand that person "anti-Semitic." I am not "anti-Semitic" but if that is the only term which can approximate my sincere belief that the US needs to pressure Israel to pull back to it's pre-Seven Days War border, with the option being an immediate cessation of all trade, military and diplomatic support of this war-lovingpack of racist hypocrites, then so be it. My many Jewish friends, business associates, and former extended family (ex-Mrs. Phaedrus #3 is Jewish, and she and her family and I are all still on very good terms) are often somewhat taken aback by my attitudes, but strangely few of them have ever been genuinely offended and none have ever gone so far as to put forward any rational challenge to my assertion that situations like the ridiculous "don't ask/don't tell" policy describer in the above story with regards to the extent to which America props up Israel's illegimitate regime.

The most important president of the 21st Century will be the one who finally draws the line with Israel and refuses to continue to indulge bullshit policies like the one outlined in the above-copied article.

Phaedrus

sphincter · Jun 27, 2003

the ex mrs.phaedrus #3???????!!!!!!!

mr p......tell me you aren`t mickey rooney....please.....

Phaedrus · Jun 27, 2003

LOL ... 31 years old and on #4 and looking like a divorce is in the imminent future ... sigh. I am extremely bad at marriage.

Phaedrus

Banned4Life · Jun 27, 2003

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR> The most important president of the 21st Century will be the one who finally draws the line with Israel and refuses to continue to indulge bullshit policies like the one outlined in the above-copied article.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Such a person will never get elected, because of <their> control of American politics and the mass media.

Oceans11 · Jun 27, 2003

I have noticed the same BS if I get involved in a thread that involves the ethnic group known as jews in other sites.

I am genuinely interested if ANY ethnic group corners a market,and uses it for its own purposes and strategy, to create and hold power and wealth.

What I did not realise previously, was that where I am from, northern europe, does not have the same ethnic tensions as other regions. Colour or religion tensions, that apply on a daily basis that I am unaware of unless I apply them to the posts that come after I have posted.
i.e. Guys that follow the racist tree monkey route, and are unable to look at it objectively.

In the US there are particular problems with Jewish posts, and black people posts.

I know that you have serious race problems in the US but there are still issues that are relevant to those of us who do not give a rats ass about the racist tree monkey element of certain posts, but we are still interested in the ethnic element of a post.

I am going to try and keep it really simple.

There is a group of American Christians who have cornered the market in gambling and racketeering.
They were so incredibly successful that they were regarded as the only ethnic group that represented this business.
They carved it up amongst themselves, and although they had 'wars' and killed each other they made sure that no other ethnic group got in their way.
There was even a film trilogy about them, called the Godfather series.

As far as I am aware, no-one has ever accused the Godfather trilogy of being racist.

But:

If anyone brings up the Jewish influence in the US media, then they are an anti-semite racist git.

Sounds a bit iffy to me chaps....

My region has catholic/protestant problems btw.

=============================================

Drinking joke. To be adapted, according to your region.
(Depends which tree monkey sect you belong to. Bannanas, coconuts, mangos, whatever)

You have a catholic, a protestant and a jew and two bullets. Who do you shoot?

Shoot the Proddy twice, make sure the bastards' dead.

[This message was edited by eek on June 27, 2003 at 08:52 PM.]

sphincter · Jun 27, 2003

this is like a flashback to germany in the 30`s and early 40`s........interesting.....let me play devils advocate(as i always like to provide an opposing view when there seems to be none provided on the forum)....an interesting article....try and be as objective as you can

"the new antisemitism—and it is new—is a global phenomenon conveyed by INTERNET, e-mail, television and video, and we do not yet know how the new communications media will affect its spread. Under such circumstances, early warning systems are important.

My analysis, in February, was sombre. Much worse has happened since. In the first two weeks of April, for example, in France synagogues, Jewish schools, student facilities and Jewish shops were attacked and firebombed. A synagogue in Marseilles was burned to the ground. Jews were attacked by gangs of hooded men wielding iron clubs. The French interior ministry reported, during those two weeks alone, 360 crimes against Jews and Jewish institutions. I was in Italy with my family at the time (it was the festival of Passover), when a Jewish couple from France, sitting next to us, received a phone call from their son, saying, 'The time has come for us to leave and go to Israel. France is not safe for us any more.'

During the same period, in Kiev, Ukraine, fifty youths chanting 'Kill the Jews' attacked a synagogue, broke twenty windows and assaulted the director of the Jewish school. In Salonika, the Holocaust memorial was defaced with Palestinian slogans. In Slovakia, Jewish cemeteries were desecrated. In Brussels, synagogues were firebombed and a travel agency specializing in tours of Israel was set alight. There were violent anti-Israel demonstrations in Amsterdam, during which rocks and bottles were thrown and shop windows broken. In Berlin, Jews were assaulted, swastikas daubed on Jewish memorials and a synagogue spray painted with the words 'Six million is not enough'.

More recently, in the United States, there has been intimidation of Jewish students. A student newspaper at Rutgers University carried an article containing the words, 'Die Jew. Die, die, die. Do us all a favour and build yourself an oven.' In Britain, two synagogues, one in London, another in Manchester, have been desecrated. One of my rabbinical colleagues was assaulted as he sat waiting for a train. Almost none of these acts was directed against an Israeli target. These were attacks on Jews, their schools and places of worship. This is not anti- Zionism, not generalized racism, not random violence, but antisemitism.

It is coming simultaneously from three different directions: first, a radicalized Islamist youth inflamed by extremist rhetoric; second, A LEFT WING ANTI-AMERICAN COGNITIVE ELITE WITH STRONG REPRESENTATION IN THE EUROPEAN MEDIA; third, a resurgent far right, as anti-Muslim as it is anti-Jewish. It is being fed by the instability of globalization, the insecurity of the post-Cold War international arena, and the still undischarged trauma of 11 September. It has been allowed to grow unchecked because of a general unwillingness among Europe's political leadership to confront the problem head on ('For evil to triumph', said Burke, 'it is necessary only for the good man to do nothing'). It has been aggravated by the breakdown of a morality of right and wrong acts in favour of a therapeutic ethic that 'feels the pain' of the perpetrators of violence. Taken in combination, these are powerful forces, to which the countervailing influences of reason, responsibility and restraint are as unequal now as they have been at any other time of populist ferment and generalized fear.

Antisemitism exists and is dangerous whenever two contradictory factors appear in combination: "THE BELIEF THAT JEWS ARE SO POWERFUL THAT THEY ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR EVILS OF THE WORLD, AND THE KNOWLEDGE THAT THEY ARE SO POWERLESS THAT THEY CAN BE ATTACKED WITH IMPUNITY". Those two factors are in abundant evidence today in many parts of the world. That this has happened with such speed and so little protest, less than sixty years after the Holocaust, is profoundly shocking. No one—not Jews, not Muslims, not Christians, no one—should suffer this kind of hate, and the moral credibility of more than one civilization is at stake. On 28 February I thought it was sufficient to sound a warning. Now I think more is needed: a call to all those with a sense of history and humanity to say 'Stop'. No problem was ever solved by hate, falsehood, racism, religiously inspired terror, and the willingness to deflect attention from real abuses of power, human rights and moral responsibility. Now is the time for good men and women to do something: to say 'Never again', and mean just that: Never again.

he makes some valid points...
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[This message was edited by sphincter on June 28, 2003 at 12:24 AM.]

Banned4Life · Jun 28, 2003

Anti-Semetic? No
Anti-Jewish? No
Anti-Zionist? Hell yeah
Zionists are "anti-Jewish" as many of them believe that most Jews (reform) aren't even true Jews. Saying you're "anti-Zionist" is like saying your anti-KKK. Both racist to the core.

sphincter · Jun 28, 2003

depends on your definition of zionism

zionism..."the national movement for the return of the Jewish people to their homeland and the resumption of Jewish sovereignty in the Land of Israel, advocated, from its inception".....

i can understand being against this...if that`s your opinion,you are entitled to it....but,the attacks on innocent people in europe because of their nationality or religion,imo, is indefensible,racist,intolerant and seems to harken back to the dark days leading up to ww2.......

[This message was edited by sphincter on June 28, 2003 at 02:28 PM.]

Phaedrus · Jun 28, 2003

Again, I don't mean for this to be a "Jews suck" thread. I have real reservations about the way that the US has handled Israel since it's re-establishment as a state. I don't believe Jews (or 'Zionists') control everything or all the media or that they are responsible for all or a substantial amount of ill in the world. I do think that policies like the above-described "don't ask/don't tell" policy on Israeli imports are worse than nonsense, as they not only serve to further embitter those who are anti-Jewish, but they also serve to create a sense of empowerment in the Ariel Sharons and Menachem Begins of the world, and can lead Israeli leadership [sic] to do things like oll bulldozers over humans (which are not really designed for such things as being rolled over by bulldozers you know) and feel that they are justified. Rather than point to a specific oppression, they can point to a specific empowerment and say, "See, we must be an oppressed and endangered people; just look at all the lengths to which our friends must go to protect us."

Put in another light, if the silly mania for boycotting French products which briefly blossomed here in the States (Mrs. Phaedrus and I switched to Freedom Ticklers

) were to have been directed towards Israel instead, according to COmmerce Department regulations no one would be able to boycott Israeli-made products, because it is against the law for companies to tell you if a given product is made in Israel. This seems to be just silly on the surface, and puerile just beneath it, given that being able to make an informed choice on whether or not to purchase a given product or service based on whatever criteria -- however foolishly formed -- a given consumer sees fit, is largely considered to be a given right in the States.

Phaedrus

sphincter · Jun 28, 2003

not another "jews suck thread"......lmao......jesus,i`m glad i`m not jewish.....what a frickin` burden it must be...

JackDee · Jun 28, 2003

"The most important president of the 21st Century will be the one who finally draws the line with Israel and refuses to continue to indulge bullshit policies like the one outlined in the above-copied article."

phaedrus, with all due respect, i see it as very naive to think that u.s. presidents are actually the ones outlining and implementing such policies. Those who do are "think tanks" for the few world wide rulers such as the billderberg conference, the trilater commision, and others. It's not like i am spilling any beans here, but the u.s. president is no more than a strawman, a front.

Phaedrus · Jun 29, 2003

Sorry Jack, but I do not subscribe to such paranoid delusions as the Illuminati Conspiracy et al. While it is certainly true that non- and quasi-government groups such as the CFR, TLC, Bilderbergs etc. wield enormous influence in the world, in the States and in the world at large our president wields a great deal of power. I should, however, have been more clear in my statement: it is not simply the president, but the presidency to whom I am looking for leadership, i.e. a solid leader with a solid administration. We haven't had one of those in years.

I don't expect someone from abroad to have a deep understanding of how the US government works, any more than I can legitimiately claim to have a deep understanding of Greek politics -- hell, most Americans have only the most ephemeral understanding of how our government works, and from what I've seen in different nations that's true of the "man on the street" in almost any country.

At any rate, chalking up all potential good and bad to a sort of shadowy rogues' gallery of influential businessmen and politicians is nothing short of of an abdication of responsibility for those in power. Frankly, I'm quite happy ascribing the responsibility of, for example, the catastrophe that is our latest Iraq invasion (day before yesterday we passed a "milestone" -- the 200th dead American in Iraq) where it belongs: on the shoulders of the sitting president and his administration.

Phaedrus

JackDee · Jun 29, 2003

"Sorry Jack, but I do not subscribe to such paranoid delusions as the Illuminati Conspiracy et al. While it is certainly true that non- and quasi-government groups such as the CFR, TLC, Bilderbergs etc. wield enormous influence in the world, in the States and in the world at large our president wields a great deal of power. I should, however, have been more clear in my statement: it is not simply the president, but the presidency to whom I am looking for leadership, i.e. a solid leader with a solid administration. We haven't had one of those in year"

Who on earth are the illuminati, last time i heard they were some sort of mystical secretive order in the 1800's. I am dissapointed if you think that proper understanding of the control mechanisms and power structures in a society are "paranoid delusions", but i stand by what i ve said, that there is no president or presidency, just interests and lobbying groups working behind the scenes and using a front for their interests, it's not like am i saying something new here, half of europe are aware that in their own countries such and such multibillionaire or church leader or other yield collectively more power than any elected government.

I dont know if you have read any sociology, i am a sociology major, and i can tell you that this is old news, theorists and practitioners of sociology can easily agree on what i am saying, that the state's power structure is far above any president or presidency, karl marx makes such a distinction between the state and the executive, max webber does, sociologists in the 60's and 70's from both this and the other side of the atlantic have extensively discussed the self same power structures in western societies that yield power, more recently jurgen haberbas and others, etc. etc.

There is no such thing as a presidency or a president. The individual outlook, if such a thing exists in such high positions, is a mere strawman and a front for complex but at the same time very concrete interests.

Also, greek politics is largely a u.s. affair

, sad but true, but at the same time very predictably so.

"Frankly, I'm quite happy ascribing the responsibility of, for example, the catastrophe that is our latest Iraq invasion (day before yesterday we passed a "milestone" -- the 200th dead American in Iraq) where it belongs: on the shoulders of the sitting president and his administration."

You might be happy to do so, i dont mean to be the reason for any cognitive dissonance in your scheme of things, for frankly i dont know you and i dont care about your views to that extent, but the truth of the matter is that you are ascribing responsibility to non existant shoulders.

Phaedrus · Jun 29, 2003

Sorry, I'm Americanising your words -- here in the States one seldom hears of the CFR et al without next hearing about some insane plot by aliens to control the coffee futures market or some such in the next breath.

Not to offend, but I don't really consider sociology to be a valid discipline. While there is considerable merit in studying the aspects of societal behaviour, I have often found in my (admittedly limited) sociology reading a tendency to limit the effects the phenomenae of free will and individual choice on a given society, as the analysis of such can be problematic to psuedo-scientists who wish to mold all mass human behaviour to fit a specific mark on a chart.

Marx was especially guilty of this, of refusing to acknowledge the gaps in his theories created by the inability of the state or society to account for individual choice. I'm suprised that you would give him any credit at all frankly, expecially in the same breath as Weber, who I've always found particularly interesting to read (I also recommend Samuelsson's Religion and Economic Action, one of the better analyses of Weber's work.)

Phaedrus

primetime21+ · Jul 5, 2003

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Phaedrus:
LOL ... 31 years old and on #4 and looking like a divorce is in the imminent future ... sigh. I am extremely bad at marriage.

Phaedrus<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I am shocked. An open minded man like yourself getting divorced so many times!

Phaedrus · Jul 5, 2003

primetime21, I don't know what the hell is wrong with me ... I just keep getting married ver and over and over again, always for the wrong reasons, and honestly -- always knowing from the outset that it's not what I want and it won't last. No idea why I keep doing it; some sort of blind spot in my common sense I suppose.

Phaedrus

Shotgun · Jul 5, 2003

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Phaedrus:
primetime21, I don't know what the hell is wrong with me ... I just keep getting married ver and over and over again, always for the wrong reasons, and honestly -- always knowing from the outset that it's not what I want and it won't last. No idea why I keep doing it; some sort of blind spot in my common sense I suppose.

Phaedrus<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Phaedrus, one of my jobs growing up was to keep young bulls from "marrying". Find a farmer with a clean emasculator; he'll gladly take care of your problem.

Phaedrus · Jul 5, 2003

Think I'll keep my nuts intact, thanks; they don't seem to be the problem anyway.

Phaedrus

JackDee · Jul 6, 2003

"Phaedrus, one of my jobs growing up was to keep young bulls from "marrying".

this speaks volumes of your character.

DarrylParsons · Jul 9, 2003

Phaedrus,

Anti-semitism, 4 wives, hmmm...makes me think...maybe you need to consider a conversion to Islam. Those guys pretty much do the same with their wives except they skip the messy divorce proceedings. Just a thought.

[This message was edited by Darryl Parsons on July 09, 2003 at 06:38 AM.]