Why won't Kerry release his military records?

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Is that a moonbat in my sites?
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John Kerry won't release his military records for public scrutiny!
Why?

Is it because he got a dishonorable discharge for colluding with the enemy?

The man is a traitor who lies and obfuscates at every opportunity; everything he does is about him! Treason would be easy for such a person
 

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There is actual testimony from P.O.W.'s that specifally say that their captors and torturers specifically referred to Kerry's Senate testimony while torturing them. Tha's pretty damning stuff.
 
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This argument is SO FLAPPIN WEAK ...

Bush did not even go to Vietnam and they cant FIND ONE SINGLE PERSON that remembers serving with the guy??? NOT ONE??? hell, I've got 5 folks that can remember playing high school golf with me back in the 1970's ....

Being Bush has lied about everything his entire live - from the Insider Trading Scandal when he was a board member @ Harken Energy to his "I dont really know the man" comment when asked about "Kenny Boy" Lay of Enron fame - a man who spent over 60 days at the Crawford ranch between 1996 - 1998 - I dont think the Bushies have any room to talk about

Remember the 94 Gov race in Tx? When Bush spread rumors that Anne Richards was a Lesbian? How bout 2000 SC primary when Bush spread rumors that McCain had a black child and was mentally unstable??? How bout having a VP that will soon be under investigation for ties with the Halliburton screw job they have done to tax payers regarding the Iraqi contracts??

Kerry served in Vietnam ... Bush did not and Cheney got 5 deferments ... Rove did not serve and neither did Limbaugh ... EVERYONE except Bush is not willing to admit this adventure into Iraq is a MAJOR FAILURE

Bush's true character was shown to one at all during the debates when he had a hard time NAMING ONE MISTAKE he has made during his term .... ONE?????? The man is a walking denial machine and is totally lost without President Dick Cheney by his side - such as the embarrassement during the 9-11 hearings when Bush & Cheney had to appear together to make sure their stories matched up

I think you should focus on the present ... if you are banking on what happened 30 yrs ago to present a case of Kerry vs Bush, pretty easy: one was getting shot at in the jungles of Vietnam while the other was AWOL from Guard Duty getting high on cocaine
 

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With all of that being said Bush still released his records, while Kerry cowers from the harm he caused P.O.W.'s. If he is such a hero, why not release his records? What is he hiding?
 

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Doc - your arguments are specious and not to the point - Kerry served the minimal amount of time in Vietnam, faked a few wounds (scratches) for Purple Hearts, and got out as quickly as possible.

By elevating a few scratches into "wounds', Kerry demeaned the true merit and meaning of the Purple Heart; he has lessened it's true value in the public mind - so that soldiers who got real, life threatening wounds, might now be viewed as something less than the true heros that they are.

By accusing fellow Vietnam Vets of widespread attrocities which did not really happen, he lessened the value of the service that each Veteran sacrificed for his Nation.

By colluding with the North Vietnamese, he aided the enemy against our soldiers serving in Vietnam, and against the POW's who were captured and tortured by those same North Vietnamese.

You try to change the subject by pointing your finger at Bush!

The facts are that Kerry was dishonorably discharged and is a traitor to this great nation!
 
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Oh give me a flappin break ...

This is sooo typical ... this country were traitors to our own soldiers when they came back ... Kerry said the same stuff that Johnson / Nixon later said on tape ....

Again, where was Cheney? Rove?? Limbaugh?? Again, NOT ONE SINGLE PERSON can remember serving with Bush???? I aint defending Kerrys actions when he came back as his testimony in front of Congress relayed Info told to him by over 150 of his comrades .. WHICH BY THE WAY, THE BUSHIES CHOP OFF AND DO NOT SHOW ON THAT TV COMMERCIAL

Meanwhile, back home 30 plus years later we have a guy who was AWOL during the Vietnam War and blew off advice from Military generals and now has this country in a very bad situation over in Iraq .... with over 1100 kids dead and over 100,000 innocent Iraqi civilians have died from our bombings ....

Again, define Traitor??? This is soooo flappin typical of the Bushies .. same crowd that have shouted that KERRY IS WEAK ON DEFENSE??? Really??? The same stuff he wanted cut is the SAME STUFF Cheney pushed to cut when he was Sect of Defense .. and Bush's hand picked boy to head up the CIA - Porter Goss - pushed bills in the late 1990's to cut Human Intelligence that went way beyond anything Kerry ever proposed

Boys .. face facts .. come next Tuesday we have 2 fine choices ... both are Skull & Bones members ... both are from the school of spend, spend, spend ... One was shot up in Vietnam and called a traitor and the other got high on coke and is called AWOL ... both are cousins .... both cater to the rich ....

Hellva choice either way!
 

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Doc, why do you keep obfuscating the issue with Bush and Cheney? I wrote about Kerry and you answer back with Bush and Cheney.

Why do ypou keep trying to change the subject?

Is this because you can't defend Kerry; that you agree that he's a traitor!

Please quit being so typically liberal and answer the question -
 
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I have said many times I do not defend what Kerry did when he came home ... he said the exact same things that Johnson/ Nixon later said on tape

The country was Traitors to our soldiers when they came back home .. the treatment was and is still disgusting ....

How can you rip Kerry a new one when Bush was AWOL and Cheney, Rove & Limbaugh did not even serve? I know guys I played golf with that served in that war and are totally somewhat mentally wacky even today ..

To call Kerry a traitor to this country is disgusting .. Bush & Company refused to serve in that war ... I will NEVER criticize the actions of someone who had the balls to defend this country when those doing the Traitor slamming did not serve one single day
 

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And more to the point is the fact that chickenhawks like bush, rove, cheney and limpbag supported the Vietnam conflict. They said to everyone who served, I have no problem if YOU go fight and die but it's not MY war. I have no problem with people who say that war was WRONG and I did what they could to not to get their ass shot off for NOTHING. Kerry was a thinking mans warrior, he went, he saw and he said this is bullshit and we shouldn't be here. I admire him for having a conscience and standing on his principles. Something bush who is supposedly so resolute lacks.
 
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Jinn:

Well said ... I will never give ANYONE **** who served in combat ...

Who was Kerry a traitor to? This country??? Hell, the way we treated our vets when they returned, who cares ... Kerry said the things about Vietnam that Johnson/ Nixon later said on tape ....

What really disgusts me is to see Cheney slamming Kerry for BEING WEAK ??? on defv ... same stuff Kerry was looking to cut was the SAME THINGS Cheney wanted cut when sect of Defv .... and Bushs hand picked puppet - Rep Porter Goss of Fla - for the CIA pushed hard to slash human intelligence funding in the late 1990's that went way beyond anything Kerry proposed

I can admit when I screw up ... have many times and find nothing wrong with that .. to see Bush give that blank look when asked that question in the debates was all I needed to know about the makeup of George Bush
 

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I heard that THREE POWs are on record from back then (I don't count any recent Republican shill add-ons) saying Kerry's words may have led to greater torture. People LIKE Kerry and the general anti-war movement SAVED how many lives? Why is everyone SO partisan as to ONLY look at one aspect of any ledger?

I'm sure Kerry would trade straight-up for Cheney's Energy Council meeting minutes!

Let's face it...unfortunately, neither of these guys has much of an estimable track record. Bush doesn't listen well or speak well. He listened to Rumsfeld over the true military experts. His economic philosophy is "trickle-down, or at least we'll get ours." He short funds alternative energy reasearch. There's much more, but it's already enough.

IMO, anyone intelligent who can surround themselves with competent people and listen well deserves a chance to lead this country now.
 

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Lawrence said:
With all of that being said Bush still released his records, while Kerry cowers from the harm he caused P.O.W.'s. If he is such a hero, why not release his records? What is he hiding?
Bullshyt you fool. Check your facts. Shrub hasn't released shyt.
Bush now says he's released all his records...if that's true, then has anyone seen:

  • Any pages from Bush's flight log
  • Records from the Flight Inquiry Board convened after Bush was suspended as a pilot
  • Any evidence of Bush's reclassification into another AFSC after suspension as a pilot
  • Any photos of George Bush in a military uniform after 1972
  • Anything at all from any Alabama unit with Bush's name on it
  • Any copies of form 44a from the Alabama National Guard certifying attendance
  • Air Force Form 142 (Aviation Service Audit Worksheet)
  • Anything proving service (not just receipt of pay) by Bush between May 1972 and May 1973?
 

Is that a moonbat in my sites?
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cussinit - why don't you try to learn how the system works before you type things that show your ignorance.

Bush signed a form 181 which is a release to thje military records divisionin St Louis to release his records for public access.

Bush signed a 181, and Kerry won't sign his.

Doc, you're a dink! Read some history! And quit obfiscating by pointing out some other persons record. The subject is Kerry. As for The Vietnam thing, remember that Kerry started this schit:
Kerry is the one who "Reported for Duty" at the DNC. He's the one who brought up his military record. He's the one who opened all of these old wounds and memories that most if not all Vietnam vets carry. He's the one who turned on his brother vets by accusing them of attrocities. He's the one who threw his medals over the White House fence to later deny it by saying they were someone elses medals - as if to say the symbology of the act meant nothing because they weren't his medals. He's the one who sat only feet from that traitor whore ***** Hanoi Jane while protesting. He's the one who went to Paris and met with the North Vietnamese.

John Kerry is a traitor!
 

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cussin'it said:
Bullshyt you fool. Check your facts. Shrub hasn't released shyt.
Bush now says he's released all his records...if that's true, then has anyone seen:
  • Any pages from Bush's flight log
  • Records from the Flight Inquiry Board convened after Bush was suspended as a pilot
  • Any evidence of Bush's reclassification into another AFSC after suspension as a pilot
  • Any photos of George Bush in a military uniform after 1972
  • Anything at all from any Alabama unit with Bush's name on it
  • Any copies of form 44a from the Alabama National Guard certifying attendance
  • Air Force Form 142 (Aviation Service Audit Worksheet)
  • Anything proving service (not just receipt of pay) by Bush between May 1972 and May 1973?
Why must Liberals insist with the name calling and hate mongering? The fact remains Bush did release his records, while Kerry has not. He does not want the public to know that many p.o.w.'s were tortured specifically as a result of his cowardly senate testimony. Everyone knows Bush fled to the National Guard, dranke and did coke in the 70's. But in my view that is nothing compared to the dishonorable Kerry aiding and abetting to the enemy. I'll bet you didn't know that whe he came back from Vietnam, he participated in a meeting where they actually held a vote on whether or not to start assasinating senators who supported the war. I'd hate to confuse you with the facts though.
 

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blighted, why don't you go fukk yourself some more. Are you that naive? Guess you didn't know that this jackal only releases what he wants to. 3 generations of Bush entrenchments in the intelligence business and you are gonna tell me that he complied? You are a fool too.


9-7-2004
Lawsuit uncovers new Bush guard records

WASHINGTON (AP) — President Bush ranked in the middle of his Air National Guard flight class and flew 336 hours in a fighter jet before letting his pilot status lapse and missing a key readiness drill in 1972, according to his flight records belatedly uncovered Tuesday under the Freedom of Information Act.
<TABLE class=sidebar cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD colSpan=4>
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</TD><TD class=sidebar vAlign=top width=75>Bush's Vietnam-era service in the Texas Air National Guard has become an issue in the presidential campaign.</TD><TD rowSpan=2>
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</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=bottom align=left>AP/George Bush Presidential Library</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

The Pentagon and Bush's campaign have claimed for months that all records detailing his fighter pilot career have been made public, but defense officials said they found two dozen new records detailing his training and flight logs after The Associated Press filed a lawsuit and submitted new requests under the public records law. (Related story: Ad challenges Bush service)

"Previous requests from other requesters for President Bush's Individual Flight Records did not lead to the discovery of these records because at the time President Bush left the service, flight records were subject to retention for only 24 months and we understood that neither the Air Force nor the Texas Air National Guard retained such records thereafter," the Pentagon told the AP. (Related link:Previous military records)

"Out of an abundance of caution," the government "searched a file that had been preserved in spite of this policy" and found the Bush records, the letter said. "The Department of Defense regrets this oversight during the previous search efforts."

Bush's Vietnam-era service in the Texas Air National Guard has become an issue in the presidential campaign as the candidates spar over who would make the best commander in chief. Supporters of Democratic nominee John Kerry, a decorated Vietnam combat veteran, have criticized Bush for serving stateside in the National Guard. Kerry's Republican critics claim Kerry did not deserve some of his five medals.

Bush has repeatedly said he is proud of his Air National Guard service. White House spokesmen said as late as last week the administration knew of no other records of Bush's military service.

"These documents confirm that the president served honorably in the National Guard," White House spokeswoman Claire Buchan said Tuesday night.

Democratic National Committee communications director Jano Cabrera disagreed. "For months George Bush told the nation that all his military records were public," he said. "Now we know why Bush was trying so hard to withhold these records. When his nation asked him to be on call against possible surprise attacks, Bush wasn't there."

The newly released records show Bush, a lieutenant in the Texas Air National Guard, ranked No. 22 in a class of 53 pilots when he finished his flight training at Moody Air Force Base in Georgia in 1969.

Over the next three years, he logged 326.4 hours as a pilot and an additional 9.9 hours as a co-pilot, mostly in his the F-102A jet used to intercept enemy aircraft. Of the 278 hours he flew in the interceptor, about 77 hours were in the TF-102A, the two-seat trainer version of the one-seat fighter jet.

The records show his last flight was in April 1972, which is consistent with pay records indicating Bush had a large lapse of duty between April and October of that year. Bush has said he went to Alabama in 1972 to work on an unsuccessful Republican Senate campaign. Bush skipped a required medical exam that cost him his pilot's status in August of that year.

Bush's 2000 campaign suggested the future president skipped his medical exam in part because the F-102A was nearly obsolete. Records show Bush's Texas unit flew the F-102A until 1974 and used the jets as part of an air defense drill during 1972.

A six-month historical record of his 147th Fighter Interceptor Group, also turned over to the AP on Tuesday, shows some of the training Bush missed with his colleagues during that time.

Significantly, it showed the unit joined a "24-hour active alert mission to safeguard against surprise attack" in the southern United State beginning on Oct. 6, 1972, a time when Bush did not report for duty, according to his pay records.

Bush's lone service in October was outside Texas, presumably with an Alabama unit he had permission to train with in September, October and November 1972.

As part of the mission, the 147th kept two F-102a jets — the same Bush flew before he was grounded — on ready alert to be launched within five minutes' warning.

The records also show Bush made a grade of 88 on total airmanship and a perfect 100 for flying without navigational instruments, operating a T-38 System and studying applied aerodynamics. Other scores ranged from 89 in flight planning to 98 in aviation physiology.

The newly released records do not include any from five categories of documents Bush's commanders had been required to keep in response to the gaps in Bush's training in 1972 and 1973. For example, National Guard commanders were required to perform an investigation whenever any pilot skipped a medical exam and forward the results up the Air Force chain of command. No such documents have surfaced.
 
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Cussinit:

No kidding ...

Lets see ... how bout the following Bushes??

* Prescott Bush traded illegally with the Nazis during WW2 - can one say the word "Traitor" to the USA??


* George Bush .. #41 .. a CIA field agent in Dallas Nov22, 1963 ... also involved in the Iran Contra Scandal .. buuuttt, according to him: "I was out of the loop .." yeah, sure ya were ... VP of the USA and ex head of the CIA

* Neil Bush ... ahhh, lets not forget about Brother Neil of the Silverado S& L scandal in Colorado in the 1980's in which he screwed folks out of millions .. and how bout this?? His fine was payed for by taxpayers !!!

Please, wake up ... Bush's Old Man has covered up more crap on Junior over the years .. remember how the SEC investigation was stopped "mysteriously" when they started sniffing around about the 800k Junior made on Insider Trading when he was head of the CIA??? Or how pissed the Bushes got when Juniors DWI conviction - which they thought Daddy had hidden - was discoved in October of 2000?? .... Remember, 1995??? Junior mysteriously had his drivers license changed in Texas????

The Bushes are better than Tony and the boys on the Sopranos ...
 

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doc mercer said:
Cussinit:



* George Bush .. #41 .. a CIA field agent in Dallas Nov22, 1963 ... also involved in the Iran Contra Scandal .. buuuttt, according to him: "I was out of the loop .." yeah, sure ya were ... VP of the USA and ex head of the CIA

Don't forget that George Bush's name address and phone number were in the address book of One, George de Mohrenschildt, the man who "handled" Lee Harvey Oswald.


"...The very day the Committee (House Select on Assasinations) tried to contact de Mohrenschildt about testifying, he was found dead of a gun shot wound. His personal address book was found and it contained the entry "Bush, George H. W. (Poppy) 1412 W. Ohio also Zapata Petroleum Midland." Bush's full name is George Herbert Walker Bush which matches the initials given and his earlier oil company was named Zapata Petroleum Corp. Why was his name in de Mohrenschildt's book? Is "Poppy" his CIA code name?"


http://www.sumeria.net/politics/cia-bush.html


Bush links to assasination?

Although he denies it, there is a growing body of evidence that George Bush was working for the CIA as early as 1961. Many feel he was actually recruited during his college days (which is when he joined the Skull and Bones Society, a front for the Illuminati). Bush claims to have been working for his own oil company during the early 1960's. It would make for a convenient front since he claims to have been off- shore on drilling rigs for weeks at a time. The rigs were located all over the world. Was he really on the rigs or was he running around on CIA business? The various biographies of Bush are all sketchy on this phase of his life.
During this time, Bush had moved to HOUSTON, Texas. His wife was, of course, BARBARA. His oil company was ZAPATA Off Shore Co. (which he named after a communist Mexican revolutionary who would invade towns and murder every man, woman and child. Bush also named an earlier oil company after Zapata, a questionable choice for a hero). The code name for the Bay of Pigs invasion was Operation ZAPATA! A former high-ranking Pentagon official, Col. Fletcher Prouty, was the man who secured two Navy ships for the operation. He has told of seeing the two ships repainted to non-Navy colors for the invasion. The ships were given the new names HOUSTON and BARBARA!

Of course, maybe the names were just coincidences, but Bush was living in Houston with Barbara and running Zapata in 1961 during the planning of the invasion. The name "Operation Zapata" was top secret and known only to a very few.

In 1977 and 1978, the government released nearly 100,000 pages of documents on the Kennedy assassination. One which slipped out by mistake was from the FBI to the State Department written a few days after the assassination. The State Department was worried that anti- Castro groups in Miami might stage another invasion of Cuba in the aftermath of the JFK murder. The FBI informed them that they had questioned both pro-Castro and anti-Castro groups and could find no information about such plans. The memo went on to state that the information was passed along to "George Bush of the Central Intelli- gence Agency" the day after the assassination.

Why was the information passed along to the CIA? Probably because of their previous invasion attempt and other planned attacks. Why George Bush? Probably because he was involved in previous invasion plans!


This family is bad news, has a history of it, and frimly believes in Oligarchical rule and shadow government.
 
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Cussin:

I have a close friend in Austin .... who took on Gov Bush .. got a very quick settlement as Bush was gonna have to take the stand and they could drill him on stuff Daddy had covered up .... I remember playing golf with him and told me Bush would have to talk about stuff in his past that would have destroyed any Presidential aspirations:

Judge Rules Governor Bush is Not Above the Law and Can be Held Responsible, Refuses to Dismiss Him From Lawsuit

Bush Tries To Avoid Questioning Under Oath in "Free Speech" Case

Austin, Texas


Attorneys for Governor George W. Bush faced lawyers for environmental groups and individuals in State District Court yesterday and lost. Governor Bush and the Department of Public Safety were sued by citizens who were arrested and jailed for protesting Bush's environmental policies on the public sidewalk in front of the Governor's Mansion. The lawsuit seeks to end a controversial "new policy" used to silence Bush's critics when he first started campaigning for the Presidency. Bush is responsible for the arrest and jailing of innocent Texans in violation of the Texas and U.S. Constitution. And, say the citizens, he wants out of the case because he doesn't want to answer the same questions about his past, under oath, that Bush's lawyers asked the citizens. For example, how many times has he been arrested, and for what?

The unwritten policy, which was enacted when Governor Bush began his campaign for the White House, was aimed at clearing the governor's mansion sidewalk of protesters who exposed "phony environmental policies" and campaign contributions from "corporate polluters." For years, the sidewalk has been a traditional site for the public to express their views. Now however, the "new policy" is selectively enforced. In yesterday's court session, the Judge was shown photographs of protesters wanting the Confederate flag flown over the Capitol. The 'Confederate' protesters were being allowed to do the same thing, in the same place, that landed environmentalists in jail.

Bush says he had nothing to do with the policy or the arrests.
However, few people believe that highly publicized arrests in front of the Governor's Mansion, initiated by the Governor's Protective Detail,
would have taken place without the Governor's approval.

"Governor Bush is responsible, whether he told law enforcement
officers to silence his critics, or simply gave approval with a wink and a
nod," says Rick Abraham, who was arrested along with a PTA mom from Dallas, refinery workers from Houston, and citizens from Austin.

"Bush is the Governor, the top of the heap, and the man Lt. Escalante
discussed the policy with. Even if Bush didn't cook up the plan, he
not object to it. This says he doesn't understand constitutional rights,
or he doesn't believe in them. Either prospect is frightening," says
Abraham.

Those arrested and jailed, including Karen Sloan, a worker from the
Crown Petroleum Refinery, were strip-searched and made to sleep on the floor of overcrowded cells. The Travis County Attorney refused to
prosecute the case against the citizens.

"Governor Bush thinks he's above the law," said Jim Baldauf, who was
jailed for 24 hours without being charged. "He's a hypocrite who brags
about 'leadership' and preaches about 'personal accountability' and
then says, 'I'm not responsible.' He refused to testify under oath in the
'Funeral-gate' case, he refused to give a sworn deposition in our
case, and he's refused to answer specific questions about his military
record and his drug and alcohol use. The President had to give sworn
testimony, why doesn't the Governor?"

The citizens were grilled by the Governor's lawyers about previous
arrests that may have occurred over their lifetime ? including any
related to drug and alcohol use. Governor George W. Bush, who so
freely approved of the citizens being jailed, could rightfully be asked if he knows what it's like to be deprived of his freedom. Has he ever been arrested - how many times, and what for? If George W. Bush was ever arrested, was it for exercising his right of free speech? Probably not!







 

I'm still here Mo-fo's
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"He's a hypocrite who brags
about 'leadership' and preaches about 'personal accountability' and
then says, 'I'm not responsible.' He refused to testify under oath in the
'Funeral-gate' case, he refused to give a sworn deposition in our
case, and he's refused to answer specific questions about his military
record and his drug and alcohol use. The President had to give sworn
testimony, why doesn't the Governor?



Thats all anyone needs to make a responsible vote for anyone but this criminal.

I can't believe that half of the voters are as dumb as sheep. Our problem is the secret "establishment" has it both ways this time.

Either way we will be stuck with a NE blue blood, who will continue the tradition of elititst rule. I really wished the independent movement had survived. But with oligarchical control over both parties, the demise was a foregone conclusion.

My vote is to accept the "lesser" (Kerry) of two very basic evils, but not give up the fight........Elmer Fudd, write-in for Prez.
 

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Yup, the ol' Establishment is in charge.

Half the Republicans are clearly sheeple to the extent that 50% of Repubs. polled said they believe WMDs have been found AND 50% believe there is an intrinsic connection between Al Queda and Saddam.
 

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