This is whats wrong with the NBA. You know the ending before it starts. The NBA playoffs are over rated

[CHOPTALK]

Ok all I have heard since the start of this years playoffs is: "This years playoffs are the best ever.
Yes you had a lot of series go 7 games that were not supposed to go 7 but in the end all the teams that were supposed to win won.
All the teams that were supposed to lose lost.

Round 1 Western Conference.

1 beats 8
2 beats 7
3 beats 6
5 beats 4 (no big deal there one seed difference)

Round 1 Eastern Conference

1 beats 8
2 beats 7
6 beats 3 (but not an upset. Most people had the Nets winning this series so it went the way most thought it would.)
5 beats 4 (the 4/5 is basically a coin flip but a lot of people had Washington winning this series before it started)

So if you would have asked me to pick the winner from every series in round 1 I would have been correct 100% of the time but yet somehow this is supposed to be awesome.

Round 2 Western Conference

1 beats 5
2 beats 3

Round 2 Eastern Conference

1 beats 5
2 beats 6

So if you would have asked me to pick the winner from every series in round 2 I would have been correct 100% of the time buy yet somehow this is supposed to be awesome.


So my question is what makes the NBA playoffs so great if we know whats going to happen before it even starts?
This is like someone telling you the ending of a movie before you watch it.

Every NBA season you have 3 teams that can win the title.

I count 1 team in the last 25 years that won a title that was not a top 3 seed and that was the Dallas Mavericks.

In the NFL, MLB, and NHL there are countless wildcards that have won.

As a matter of fact there has only been 1 super bowl in the NFL in the last 20 years where both #1's played each other.
This happens almost every year in the NBA.

What is the incentive for the other 27 teams in the NBA to even care?
How sad is it to know that if your name is not Miami, San Antonio, or Oklahoma City you have 0 chance of winning a championship?

Could you imagine how boring the NFL would be if you knew there were only 3 teams that could win a super bowl?

And this is supposed to be the greatest NBA playoffs season in 20 years or more but yet I could have predicted before the playoffs started who would win every series.
WTF is that?

 

[Willie99]

so, who wins the conference finals and who wins the championship?





PS: I'm not a big fan of the NBA, and I only start paying attention after the NCAA finals, so I concur it kinda sucks

it's easy for me to watch something else, I hate watching Joey Crawford

 

[PatsFan1283]

If you know all the results ahead of time I'd probably work on trying to monetize that



Sure it has less variance than the other leagues, doesn't mean it is a slam dunk figuring out who is going to win.

Especially considering how much 1 simple injury can change a teams chances. Much more impactful than the other sports.

 

[CHOPTALK]

If you know all the results ahead of time I'd probably work on trying to monetize that

OH I'm fucked ATS.
But I guess I should look into betting on series.

I mean you are an NBA guy.

Has there been any series where the team you thought was going to win lost?

I know it was very popular at the beginning to dump on INDY, and for a while it looked like they were right.
But in the end its #1 against #2.

 

[CHOPTALK]

Just like Lebron said.
He knew since the beginning of the season it would be them against INDY.

 

[PatsFan1283]

Also pretty sure the '95 Rockets were a 6 seed. Just sayin'

Celts in 2010 people absolutely left for dead before the playoffs started

 

[Willie99]

Also pretty sure the '95 Rockets were a 6 seed. Just sayin'

Celts in 2010 people absolutely left for dead before the playoffs started

1995? are you trying to prove Chop's point?

 

[CHOPTALK]

Damn.
Who took the Donald Sterling and Justin Cruise off my thread title?
Thats going to cut the traffic down on this thread by over 90%.

 

[PatsFan1283]

lol I just knew Rockets off my head cause that is the lowest seed to win a title pretty sure.

@Chop, you are asking me if a team ever won a series that I thought wouldn't? Houston 2 weeks ago?

I get it is more predictable but if it was as predictable as you are making it sound, we would all be rich beyond our wildest dreams and wouldn't need to rely on JustinCruise picks.

 

[CHOPTALK]

lol I just knew Rockets off my head cause that is the lowest seed to win a title pretty sure.

@Chop, you are asking me if a team ever won a series that I thought wouldn't? Houston 2 weeks ago?

I get it is more predictable but if it was as predictable as you are making it sound, we would all be rich beyond our wildest dreams and wouldn't need to rely on JustinCruise picks.

Ok. So maybe one team out of 12 series pulled a mild upset in your mind.

Is there any team in the final 4 that you thought would not be in the final 4?

There have been football and baseball seasons in the past where all of the final 4 was a surprise.

Heck I can't remember the last time the preseason MLB favorite won the world series.
That might have been over 10 years ago or more.

Heck the Angels were the favorites in vegas last season and they lost over 90 games last year.
Stuff like that has never happened in the NBA.

Could you imagine the Miami Heat only winning 20 games this season?
Impossible.

 

[PatsFan1283]

yeah there is way less variance in the NBA than other sports.

4 out of 7, homecourt mattering more and it being a game of bigger edges

Upsets do happen though..

Pistons were +600 vs LAL in the '04 finals and won in 5
LeBron's last 2 years in Cle they lost as massive favs
Dallas in '07 had the best record and Dirk won MVP, they lost in 6 to GState as a 10-1 fav
Dallas beating Miami in the finals in '11
Celts in '08 were underdogs to the Lakers WITH homecourt advantage as hard as that is to believe.

Most recently, San Antonio beating Miami in the finals as a 2-1 dog last year.
Oh wait, they blew that in the most excrutiating way possible.

 

[CHOPTALK]

yeah there is way less variance in the NBA than other sports.

4 out of 7, homecourt mattering more and it being a game of bigger edges

Upsets do happen though..

Pistons were +600 vs LAL in the '04 finals and won in 5
LeBron's last 2 years in Cle they lost as massive favs
Dallas in '07 had the best record and Dirk won MVP, they lost in 6 to GState as a 10-1 fav
Dallas beating Miami in the finals in '11
Celts in '08 were underdogs to the Lakers WITH homecourt advantage as hard as that is to believe.

Most recently, San Antonio beating Miami in the finals as a 2-1 dog last year.
Oh wait, they blew that in the most excrutiating way possible.

I think you have to have variance.

If you are a season ticket holder of the Tampa Bay Bucs you can pretend that your team has a chance to win the super bowl.
If you are a season ticket holder of the Colorado Rockies you can pretend that your team has a chance to win the world series.

If you are season ticket holder of any team not named the Heat, Spurs or Thunder you have to choose between wanting to get eliminated in the 1st or 2nd round of the playoffs or hoping you lose enough games to get the bouncing ball to go your way in the lottery hoping that one day if you get lucky you might be one of those 3 teams that have a chance to win one day.

There is no middle class in the NBA.

What is the point of being a Pelicans fan?
What is the point of being a Raptors fan?

You have 3 upper class teams and 27 lower class teams.

 

[PatsFan1283]

Yeah I think that is a big thing that holds the NBA back. The fact its revenues are comparable to a sport like MLB in a ADHD society shows this.

Most fans first and foremost just want to root for their team and think they have a shot. Obviously a huge reason the NFL is so popular. That definitely holds the NBA back and is something the NHL excels at. The NHL has diehard fans...What is the point of being a diehard Raptors or Bucks fan? Not much unless you just love basketball or something.

I think it is trending in a direction of slightly more parity. You got 4 teams left that are good, LAC was good, I think Houston was good and just f'd up but I can't prove it.

With more player movement you are getting more guys making good teams rather than the status quo of just 1-2 very good teams.

If you think it is bad now, trust me it has been a lot worse. Like the year LeBron took a team to the finals by himself, or when the Nets made it back to back years. Those teams had no chance to win the title.

The 90s bulls were an all time great team but there wasn't much drama or unpredictability in their run at all. During that whole run there was never 1 time where it was like "oh shit this might be it" sans maybe game 7 vs Indiana in '98.

LeBron and the Heat have already had like 4-5 moments like that, including a loss in the finals.

 

[Seymour]

NBA playoffs are my favorite thing to watch - one game I prefer the Superbowl or NCAA tourney - but the playoffs are a season in and of it's itself - of course I'm a die had SA fan so that makes a huge difference - though even if SA loses i enjoy rooting against Miami as i do for SA

 

[CHOPTALK]

Yeah I think that is a big thing that holds the NBA back. The fact its revenues are comparable to a sport like MLB in a ADHD society shows this.

Most fans first and foremost just want to root for their team and think they have a shot. Obviously a huge reason the NFL is so popular. That definitely holds the NBA back and is something the NHL excels at. The NHL has diehard fans...What is the point of being a diehard Raptors or Bucks fan? Not much unless you just love basketball or something.

I think it is trending in a direction of slightly more parity. You got 4 teams left that are good, LAC was good, I think Houston was good and just f'd up but I can't prove it.

With more player movement you are getting more guys making good teams rather than the status quo of just 1-2 very good teams.

If you think it is bad now, trust me it has been a lot worse. Like the year LeBron took a team to the finals by himself, or when the Nets made it back to back years. Those teams had no chance to win the title.

The 90s bulls were an all time great team but there wasn't much drama or unpredictability in their run at all. During that whole run there was never 1 time where it was like "oh shit this might be it" sans maybe game 7 vs Indiana in '98.

LeBron and the Heat have already had like 4-5 moments like that, including a loss in the finals.

What the NBA desperately needs is to have a season where a team like the 2014 Atlanta Hawks or a team like the 2014 Charlotte Bobcats surprise the world and win a title.
But me and you both know this is impossible and will never happen.

But the above scenario happens all the time in football and baseball.
Its almost the norm.

The Green Bay Packers had to have 3 games go there way in week 17 just to make the playoffs.
Then they go on to win the Superbowl.
I can name a dozen examples like that.

The Super Bowl Manning won might have been his worst team in INDY. They barely made the playoffs that season.

I can go on and on.

I think Detroit is the first team in years a couple of years ago to have the best record in baseball and win the world series.
But even that Detroit team was not even close to a consensus favorite before the season started.

I think you would probably have to go back all the way to the 2000 Yanks to find a team that was a 100% prohibitive favorite to win the world series who actually won the world series.

 

[PatsFan1283]

I think the NBA did have that not so long ago though. Dallas was probably like 40 or 50-1 to win the title when the season started. Not exactly an 8 seed but they weren't top 5 in anyones power rankings to start the season. People forget this now but the Spurs were kinda left for dead for a little bit, they didn't win 1 2nd rd game from 2009 to 2011. Then they had their rejuvenation in 2012 and have been contenders ever since...

I think it is an interesting balance. A league wants some unpredictability, but you don't want so much unpredictability that it almost devalues winning and has a World Series of Poker Who Can Get Lucky type feel to it.

 

[CHOPTALK]

I think the NBA did have that not so long ago though. Dallas was probably like 40 or 50-1 to win the title when the season started. Not exactly an 8 seed but they weren't top 5 in anyones power rankings to start the season. People forget this now but the Spurs were kinda left for dead for a little bit, they didn't win 1 2nd rd game from 2009 to 2011. Then they had their rejuvenation in 2012 and have been contenders ever since...

I think it is an interesting balance. A league wants some unpredictability, but you don't want so much unpredictability that it almost devalues winning and has a World Series of Poker Who Can Get Lucky type feel to it.

I understand Dallas was a slight exception, thats why I included them in the OP of this thread.
But even dallas is a stretch when comparing them to a team like the 2014 Hawks or Bobcats.

And yes I agree with the WSOP part.
Way too much variance in that example.

When the worst player in the world is capable of beating the best player in the world head up on any given day the variance is too high.
And Phil Ivy can be beat randomly heads up on any given day by anyone capable of saying the words "all in".

 

[PatsFan1283]

Don't you think baseball in the postseason has that feel though?

They're playing in weather conditions that we don't see for the entire regular season. Bats go cold (no pun intended) and it is just a free for all. The game is a game of small edges and anyone can win. I think that somewhat devalues winning when it is just about getting hot at the right time.

For instance, in MLB GMs aren't even evaluated on postseason success because it is pretty much known that it is very random. Since Moneyball got popular, it's been pretty much known in front offices that the goal is just to get to the postseason as much as possible and hope to break through.

 

[CHOPTALK]

Don't you think baseball in the postseason has that feel though?

They're playing in weather conditions that we don't see for the entire regular season. Bats go cold (no pun intended) and it is just a free for all. The game is a game of small edges and anyone can win. I think that somewhat devalues winning when it is just about getting hot at the right time.

For instance, in MLB GMs aren't even evaluated on postseason success because it is pretty much known that it is very random. Since Moneyball got popular, it's been pretty much known in front offices that the goal is just to get to the postseason as much as possible and hope to break through.

There is no doubt that the NBA is the most efficient sport of all the major sports at crowning the true best team in the league.
Almost 100% of the time or at least 90% of the time I can honestly say the best team in the NBA has the trophy at the end of the season.

In baseball and football this is not the case.

But is that really a bad thing?
Thats the question.

 

[CHOPTALK]

There is no doubt that the NBA is the most efficient sport of all the major sports at crowning the true best team in the league.
Almost 100% of the time or at least 90% of the time I can honestly say the best team in the NBA has the trophy at the end of the season.

In baseball and football this is not the case.

But is that really a bad thing?
Thats the question.

I think in order for baseball to crown an efficient champ year after year you would probably have to have a 30 game world series.

7 games is just too short for a sport like baseball to efficiently crown a champ.

And the 5 game sub series and the abominable 1 game playoff they started for the last wild card makes it even worse.

If the true goal is to give the best team the trophy at the end of the season the NBA is king.

In football you have single elimination playoffs.
Anything can happen in 1 game.

If the NBA had 1 game series maybe you would get lucky and have a team like Toronto win an NBA title.

I am not arguing the fact that the NBA is the most efficient at crowning the true best team, but the fan in me does not find that as fun.

Sometimes drama is good.