The Western Disease

Search

New member
Joined
Sep 20, 2004
Messages
1,730
Tokens
Here are some excerpts from a great article in the National Review (http://www.nationalreview.com/hanson/hanson200312300000.asp


After watching a string of editorial attacks on America both at home and from abroad in the aftermath of Saddam’s capture, I thought back to the actual record of the last two years. In 24 months the United States defeated two of the most hideous regimes in modern memory. For all the sorrow involved, it has already made progress in the unthinkable: bringing consensual government into the heart of Middle Eastern autocracy, where there has been no political heritage other than tyranny, theocracy, and dictatorship.

In liberating 50 million people from both the Taliban and Saddam Hussein it has lost so far less than 500 soldiers — some of whom were killed precisely because they waged a war that sought to minimalize not just civilian casualties but even the killing of their enemies. Contrary to the invective of Western intellectuals, the American military’s sins until recently have been of omission — preferring not to shoot looters or hunt down and kill insurgents — rather than brutal commission. While the United States has conducted these successive wars some 7,000 miles beyond its borders, it also avoided another terrorist attack of the scale of September 11 — and all the while crafting a policy of containment of North Korea and soon-to-be nuclear Iran."

"There is something terribly wrong, something terribly amoral with the Western intelligentsia, most prominently in academia, the media, and politics. We don’t need Osama bin Laden’s preschool jabbering about “the weak horse” to be worried about the causes of this Western disease: thousands of the richest, most leisured people in the history of civilization have become self-absorbed, ungracious, and completely divorced from the natural world — the age-old horrific realities of dearth, plague, hunger, rapine, or conquest.

Indeed, it is even worse than that: a Paul Krugman or French barrister neither knows anything of how life is lived beyond his artificial cocoon nor of the rather different men and women whose unacknowledged work in the shadows ensures his own bounty in such a pampered landscape — toil that allows our anointed to rage at those purportedly culpable for allowing the world to function differently from an Ivy League lounge or the newsroom of the New York Times. Neither knows what it is like to be in a village gassed by Saddam Hussein or how hard it is to go across the world to Tikrit and chain such a monster.

Our Western intellectuals are sheltered orchids who are naïve about the world beyond their upscale hothouses. The Western disease of deductive fury at everything the West does provides a sort of psychological relief (without costs) for apparent guilt over privileged circumstances. It is such a strange mixture of faux-populism and aristocratic snobbery. They believe only a blessed few such as themselves have the requisite education or breeding to understand the “real” world of Western pathologies and its victims."


"To sum up the Arab street: It appears to care not a whit that a native psychopath butchered hundreds of thousands of its own — only that his anti-American braggadocio was revealed to be a sham to millions and that Americans of all people had to free Iraqis from such a menace. Honor and shame — the stuff of tribal societies — matter more than the lives of innocents. If a pundit from Paris was riled that Saddam was not yet advised by an international human-rights lawyer, the masses on the West Bank trumped that concern by lamenting that he had not even machine-gunned an American on his way out — or indeed done anything to restore Arab tribal pride. Lost between the shared loony sympathies of the first-world elite and the third-world clan, between refined postmodern and uncouth premodern societies, was an iota of lamentation for the dead, those rotting and dried-out bones that appear in the thousands in desert sands outside Baghdad.


"It was the genius of bin Laden, after all, that he suspected after he had incinerated 3,000 Westerners an elite would be more likely to blame itself for the calamity — searching for “root causes” than marshalling its legions to defeat a tribe that embraced theocracy, autocracy, gender apartheid, polygamy, anti-Semitism, and religious intolerance. And why not after Lebanon, the first World Trade Center bombing, the embassies in Africa, murder in Saudi Arabia, and the USS Cole? It was the folly of bin Laden only that he assumed the United States was as far gone as Europe and that a minority of its ashamed elites had completely assumed control of American political, cultural, and spiritual life."

"Indeed, the liberal Europeans should love Israel, whose social and cultural institutions — universities, the fine arts, concern for the “other” — so reflect its own. Gays are in the Israeli military, whose soldiers rarely salute, but usually address each other by their first names and accept a gender equity that any feminist would love. And while Arabs once may have been exterminated by Syrians, gassed in Yemen by Egypt, ethnically cleansed in Kuwait, lynched without trial in Palestine, burned alive in Saudi Arabia, inside Israel proper they vote and enjoy human rights not found elsewhere in the Arab Middle East.

When Europe frets over the “Right of Return” do they mean the over half-million Jews who were sent running for their lives from Egypt, Syria, and Iraq? Or do they ever ask why a million Arabs live freely in Israel and another 100,000 illegally have entered the “Zionist entity”? Does a European ever ask what would happen should thousands of Jews demand “A Right of Return” to Cairo?

Instead, the elite Westerner talks about “occupied lands” from which Israel has been attacked four times in the last 60 years — in a manner that Germans do not talk about an occupied West they coughed up to France or an occupied East annexed by Poland. Russia lectures about Jenin, but rarely its grab of Japanese islands. Turkey is worried about the West Bank, but not its swallowing much of Cyprus. China weighs in about Palestinian sovereignty but not the entire culture of Tibet; some British aristocrats bemoan Sharon’s supposed land grab, but not Gibraltar."
 

New member
Joined
Sep 21, 2004
Messages
2,228
Tokens
icon_smile.gif


Sounds to me like you're limbering up for a modern colonialist crusade.

You can smother it in as much BS as you like.
A turd is still a turd, even if you smother it in media honey.

In the previous 5 centuries we brought the 'godless heathens' and their 'brutal uncivilised tribes' the 'light of christianity'.

As everyone knows, colonialism was an incredible success.
All those countries really appreciated being invaded by foreigners.

As a child, you learn that sticking your hand into a flame, will get it burned.
Common sense dictates that you don't do it again.
Unless you're stupid or delusional.

Covering your hand with a thick military glove will not change the long term effect of that flame on your hand.
You get to grit your teeth, and hang on in there, for a bit longer than before, while the glove burns.

But some kids just won't take a telling.
They just have to learn the hard way.
 

New member
Joined
Sep 21, 2004
Messages
877
Tokens
"Chile's red democracy bumped off by white house pots and pans... as a warning to mediterranean governments"
 

"The Real Original Rx. Borat"
Joined
Sep 21, 2004
Messages
2,882
Tokens
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Shotgun:
Instead, the elite Westerner talks about “occupied lands” from which Israel has been attacked four times in the last 60 years — in a manner that Germans do not talk about an occupied West they coughed up to France or an occupied East annexed by Poland. Russia lectures about Jenin, but rarely its grab of Japanese islands. Turkey is worried about the West Bank, but not its swallowing much of Cyprus. China weighs in about Palestinian sovereignty but not the entire culture of Tibet; some British aristocrats bemoan Sharon’s supposed land grab, but not Gibraltar."<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Be that as it may I was talking to a former Israeli soldier. He said "both sides are stupid, bothe sides are stubborn" he went on to say that "you have to give up a little something to get something in return" and the one thing he said that makes the most sense is that you have to either kill them all or make peace asap because if someone loses a family member or a friend you stop thinking rationally for the most part. The killing does more harm than good and hardens the resolve of those close to the people killed.

Talk about right of return, do we have any lawyers here that can imagine a scenario where Native Americans sue to get North America back. I thinkn that's factored into the thinking of America's politicians. This would all have been resolved a long time ago if someone who had a clue drew up the partitions of the fallen ottoman empire. It is not too late in my opinion. look at all that land in turkey,Jordan and Syria.
 

New member
Joined
Sep 21, 2004
Messages
2,228
Tokens
The only things you can say about that entire region.

Both sides are as stupid as each other.
As long as either side thinks there can be a winner, it will never end.
----------------------------------------
The Ottoman empire...?
The only reason mainland Saudi is 'excluded' is because there was no oil back then, and you couldn't use the sand for anything.
Only coastlines mattered, for trading and troop movements.

http://www.fsmitha.com/h3/map21-ot.html

(Its another reason why the Greeks and Turks hate each other too btw.)

So whats the pre-Ottoman situ??
It makes nowadays look like a walk in the park....

http://www.euratlas.com/big/big1300.htm
http://www.euratlas.com/big/big1400.htm

Actually, with those kingdoms, it looks like something out of Lord of the flipping Rings.

Federation of the Black Sheep....
Empire of the Ilkhans Jalayrids...
Dominion of Emir Timur...

Sounds like a mission for 007 Frodo.

[This message was edited by eek on January 06, 2004 at 07:02 PM.]
 

Forum statistics

Threads
1,119,866
Messages
13,574,314
Members
100,878
Latest member
fo88giftt
The RX is the sports betting industry's leading information portal for bonuses, picks, and sportsbook reviews. Find the best deals offered by a sportsbook in your state and browse our free picks section.FacebookTwitterInstagramContact Usforum@therx.com