student loan debt = the next bubble to burst

[Willie99]

HA! Except most of finance & accounting can and will eventually be done on-line IT programming, no need for masses of bean counters in big companies, any more. Sure there will still be some, but far fewer accountants & financial managers. TurboTax.

Lawyers? Cases are on line, cross referenced, remember movies where during a trial lawyers go to the library at night and look things over? Now, IT programs can search massive data for key words in editing, discovery, etc etc. So, fewer lawyers.

Sales... all the information is on the web, specs, pricing, you name it. Sure some big deals still happen, but no need for a salesman to show you products and services and answer questions.

Teachers? Put a video on a wide screen, teach 75% of the lessons that way...

Obama was right about this subject, used the ATM example, but in a rare instance, he was correct.

The college education propaganda is a scam, getting useless degrees, going to low tier institutions that are not up to previous standards, is harmful to our economy. Kids go into debt and cannot get a decent job and refuse to get jobs that they should have been designated for because they think they have a college degree. Example, construction work that pays very well is there and nobody wants to do it.

Nobody's replacing me, too much grey in this world . Plus I'm a fixer, I'm an interpreter and I have incredible communication skills.

I dig, I look for exceptions to the exceptions, I know business and personal lives, I'm thinking there's a lot more to my job than many people realize

 

[Willie99]

FWIW, RT knows the job market more than any of us do. He is to jobs what I am to taxes

 

[SgtLanquel]

FWIW, RT knows the job market more than any of us do. He is to jobs what I am to taxes

+1 on both of the above

Willie knows income tax and Rolltide knows the overall market for anyone wishing to be an employee.

Most others commenting on the two above topics are overly anecdotal

 

[rolltide]

I know a republican congressman (don't remember his name) is trying to write a bill that will allow employers to offer up to 5k/yr in pre-tax student loan repayments. I don't know the details, I just heard the overview. I'll see if I can find more about it

seems a decent plan to help new-grads while giving employers an excellent benefit option and likely help with retention. in the end it's lipstick on a pig because the real need is to target rising college costs, kids choice of major and school, etc to keep from falling into this $1.5T hole.... but at least it's a semi-creative way to get $450/month back via employers who are recipients of this education


here's the plan details https://www.plansponsor.com/lawmake...ployers-offer-student-loan-repayment-benefit/

full legislation at https://www.scribd.com/document/399...oyer-Participation-in-Repayment-Act-One-Pager


Bill Introduced to Help Employers Offer Student Loan Repayment Benefit

The legislation would permit employers to contribute up to $5,250 tax-free to their employees’ student loans.

Senators John Thune, R-South Dakota, and Mark Warner, D-Virginia, have introduced the Employer Participation in Repayment Act, which would permit employers to contribute up to $5,250 tax-free to their employees’ student loans.
The bill would expand the Employer Education Assistance Program, which only provides assistance for workers who are seeking additional education, but does not benefit individuals who already have incurred student loan debt. The legislation has also been introduced in the House of Representatives by Reps. Rodney Davis, R-Illinois, and Scott Peters, D-California, and has support from numerous educational organizations.
The senators issued a press release noting that one in four Americans have student loans, and that these loans total $1.5 trillion in the U.S.

“Today’s economy is strong, and I believe we should keep our foot on the gas by passing commonsense bills like the one Senator Warner and I have proposed that would give young career seekers additional tools to help overcome the burden of student loan debt and empower employers to attract future talent,” Thune said. “It’s no secret that as today’s college graduates look toward the next chapter in life, they often trade their cap and gown for debt and uncertainty. This bipartisan legislation, which I view as a win-win for graduates and employers, is good policy and one that I hope garners strong support.”

Warner added: “As the first in my family to graduate from college, I relied on student loans when college tuition was much lower than it is today. Unfortunately, as the cost of higher education continues to skyrocket, so has the rate of Americans who turn to student loans to pay for college. That’s why I’ve teamed up with Senator Thune to create an innovative, bipartisan approach to help ease the burden of student loans. By making employer student loan repayments tax-exempt, employers will have a new tool to recruit and retain a talented workforce while also helping working Americans manage their financial future.”

 

[PoundFoolish]

Am I missing something in this conversation? There is wage garnishment for federal loans if the $ isn't recouped or settled in collections.

I don't know anyone that has just said screw it and not paid their student loans unless they were flat broke.


As far as what is making costs soar though...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/presto...-student-loans-drive-up-tuition/#1ade12fd52b6

The loans are too subsidized. If they weren't then a lot of the froth in higher ed (bloated admin budgets, schools looking like country clubs, useless majors, etc) would dry up.

BINGO! This is exactly right....if the Federal Govt told McDonalds they would pay .50 towards every item ordered on their $1 menu, what would McDonalds do immediately? The $1 menu would now be the $1.50 menu

 

[bilbal]

Fair enough. I won't argue that there are people who over-extend themselves for dream houses, cars, weddings, etc. Your last statement "dream college" ... MOST colleges are through-the-roof expensive though and not many options with regard to an "affordable" college. College isn't what it used to be back when you could work a part-time job somewhere to earn enough to pay for college. The idea that going to college is putting young people in debt for 10-20 years is ludicrous. I'm not saying blame is exclusive to the schools, govt, or students -- just the current system is not sustainable as exemplified in your original post.

If the federal government is going to dole out student loans, the interest rate on those should be fair -- and possibly lowered or eliminated in return for public service.

BTW you never commented on my idea for "free college" -- Curious of your take on it. I think its reasonable anyway.

What happened that caused colleges to become "through the roof expensive"? The government got involved. Whenever they do, costs explode, whether it's housing, health care or education. They made it far too easy to get loans and the more money students are allowed to borrow, the higher the tuition. Why? Because the colleges know that easy financial aid can cover the difference. "For profit" institutions that accept federal aid have tuition rates almost 80% higher than ones that do not. If such easy money wasn't available, college costs would not be 'through the roof' right now, so you can thank the government for trying to help and, as usual, making it a complete disaster. Colleges get the loan money, the government gets the principal and interest and the student gets a piece of paper and a loan to repay. Now the government is trying to "help" again and you can rest assured it will be another disaster.

 

[Willie99]

What happened that caused colleges to become "through the roof expensive"? The government got involved. Whenever they do, costs explode, whether it's housing, health care or education. They made it far too easy to get loans and the more money students are allowed to borrow, the higher the tuition. Why? Because the colleges know that easy financial aid can cover the difference. "For profit" institutions that accept federal aid have tuition rates almost 80% higher than ones that do not. If such easy money wasn't available, college costs would not be 'through the roof' right now, so you can thank the government for trying to help and, as usual, making it a complete disaster. Colleges get the loan money, the government gets the principal and interest and the student gets a piece of paper and a loan to repay. Now the government is trying to "help" again and you can rest assured it will be another disaster.

And that's the bottom line

 

[WoodStool]

And that's the bottom line

Cause Stone Cold said so...!

 

[Willie99]

Everything our federal government touches they fuck up.

The war on poverty put poverty on steroids, they totally fucked up the very fabric of the inner-city family

Making college affordable has increased our college costs ten fold, as we pay hundreds of thousands of dollars more than any other country

Obamacare accomplished to polar opposite of everything it promised, worst health care for more money, that's what liberals gave us

The war on drugs? hahahaha, paved the way for the legalization of drugs

Prohibition? another classic

Social security and medicare? Those programs are in so much debt the numbers dwarf the debt we actually talk about

Poor people have been voting for liberal solutions for 50+ years now, and they're poorer than ever


Why people continue to have faith in government solutions is beyond my comprehension, it's like thinking this is the year the Lions are going to win the SB, and thinking that every year since the inception of the SB

If Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer are you political heroes, you're a fucking idiot, meant in the most respectful way possible of course

 

[Willie99]

Everything our federal government touches they fuck up.

The war on poverty put poverty on steroids, they totally fucked up the very fabric of the inner-city family

Making college affordable has increased our college costs ten fold, as we pay hundreds of thousands of dollars more than any other country

Obamacare accomplished to polar opposite of everything it promised, worst health care for more money, that's what liberals gave us

The war on drugs? hahahaha, paved the way for the legalization of drugs

Prohibition? another classic

Social security and medicare? Those programs are in so much debt the numbers dwarf the debt we actually talk about

Poor people have been voting for liberal solutions for 50+ years now, and they're poorer than ever


Why people continue to have faith in government solutions is beyond my comprehension, it's like thinking this is the year the Lions are going to win the SB, and thinking that every year since the inception of the SB

If Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer are you political heroes, you're a fucking idiot, meant in the most respectful way possible of course

 

[rolltide]

remember the fed owning student loans is primarily the result of Obamacare. it was the Affordable Care Act that essentially privatized student loans into a govt program. Prior to ACA nearly 60% of student loans were privately held through banks and lenders. After ACA the govt became both lender and guarantor and now the govt loses $200B/yr on student loans with future taxpayers as the guarantor

the idea was for the govt to borrow at 2.8% and charge students 6.8%. that 4% profit would pay for the Obamacare healthcare plan. Like all govt planning programs it backfired and now losses a few hundred billion per year

let's pass it now and we can read what's in it later....

 

[Michelangelo]

Because in a pure meritocracy, which is pretty much what America was before LBJ's Great Society programs, they are all f'd.

The loafers can't compete so they loaf. The government workers can't compete with their equals in the private sector so they work for the government. Yes, that includes the clueless politicians.

"Equality" in a meritocracy assumes everyone in the society has the same moral values, and the discipline to work and study hard to find your individual path to prosperity which collectively fuels a Great Society. LBJ's version deincentivises. A pure meritocracy incentivises.

Government is the only solution for those who have limited values, limited discipline, and limited interest in working and studying hard to better themselves so that they can compete.

 

[rolltide]

and what are these kids studying?



[FONT=&quot]#1 Harvard University: FRSEMR 62O—Who is a Fascist? Culture and Politics on the Radical Right[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#2 Princeton University: FRS 139—Marx in the 21st Century[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#3 Yale University: AMST 469a—Progressivism: Theory and Practice[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#4 University of Alabama: SW 351—Oppression & Social Justice[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#5 University of Florida: WST 3349—Ecofeminism[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#6 University of Florida: POT 4053—Great Political Thinkers: Machiavelli to Marx[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#7 University of Kentucky: SOC 235—Inequalities in Society[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#8 University of Missouri: PSYCH 4984—Promoting Social Justice, Diversity, and Inclusion Capstone[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#9 Middlebury College: AMST 0269—Beyond Intersectionality: Developing Anti-Racist and Anti-Capitalist Feminisms[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#10 Middlebury College: ECON 0405—Economics of Discrimination[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#11 University of Minnesota: AFRO 1917—Inequality and the American Dream[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#12 University of Minnesota: SOC 3507—Immigration to the United States: Beyond Walls[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#13 University of Minnesota: CSCL 3405—Marx for Today[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#14 University of Minnesota: CI 5137—Multicultural Gender-Fair Curriculum[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#15 University of Iowa: GWSS 1005—Introduction to Social Justice[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#16 University of Iowa: GWSS 2045—Working for Social Justice[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#17 University of Illinois: GWS 337—Interrogating Masculinities[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#18 Indiana University: GNDR-G 330—Looking Like a Feminist: Visual Culture and Critical Theory[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#19 University of Maryland: WMST 300—Feminist Reconceptualizations of Knowledge[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#20 University of Michigan: WOMENSTD 434—Eco/Queer/Feminist Art Practices[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#21 Michigan State University: ANP 859—Gender, Justice, and Environmental Change: Methods and Application[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#22 Ohio State University: WGSST 3200—Breaking the Law: An Introduction to Gender Justice[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#23 Penn State University: AFAM 147—The Life and Thought of Malcolm X[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#24 Purdue University: OLS 45400—Gender And Diversity In Management[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#25 University of Wisconsin: HISTORY 346—Trans/Gender in Historical Perspective[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#26 University of Wisconsin: GEN&WS 536—Queering Sexuality Education[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#27 University of Wisconsin: AFRICAN 233—Global HipHop and Social Justice[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#28 Williams College: AFR 342—Racial Capitalism[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#29 Williams College: AMST 219—Understanding Social Class[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#30 Williams College: ENVI 103—Global Warming and Environmental Change[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#31 Amherst College: POSC 407—Contemporary Debates: Gender and Right-Wing Populism[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#32 Amherst College: SWAG 351—From Birth to Death: LGBTQ Life Trajectories[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#33 Swarthmore College: ENVS 043—Race, Gender, Class and Environment[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#34 Swarthmore College: RELG 032—Queering God: Feminist and Queer Theology[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#35 Swarthmore College: RELG 033—Queering the Bible[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#36 Wellesley College: AMST 281—Rainbow Republic: American Queer Culture from Walt Whitman to Lady Gaga[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#37 Wellesley College: SOC 205—Modern Families and Social Inequalities[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#38 Carleton College: POSC 275—Black Radical Political Thought[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#39 Pomona College: AFRI144A—Black Women Feminism(s) and Social Change[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#40 Pomona College: GWS142—Queering Childhood[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#41 Claremont McKenna College: GOVT113—Inequality, Politics, and Public Policy: Class, Race, and Gender[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#42 Davidson College: SOC 356—Feminization of Poverty[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#43 Butler University: RI379—The Problem of God[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#44 Creighton University: ANT 178—Global Citizenship[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#45 DePaul University: LGQ 338—Sexual Justice: Lesbians, Gays and the Law[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#46 Georgetown University: WGST 250—The Breast: Image, Myth, Legend[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#47 Providence College: SOC 418—Globalization and Social Justice[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#48 St. John’s University: SOC 1170—Inequality; Race, Class and Gender[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#49 University of Pennsylvania: RELS 110—American Jesus[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]#50 University of Pennsylvania: URBS 050—Womanism and Identity Politics in the Realm of Hip-Hop[/FONT]

 

[Michelangelo]

Could we possibly fit some physics or engineering in there?

Naw. Who cares about that stupid stuff.

 

[rolltide]

imagine being the parents of a kid going to Williams College for $70k/yr (tuition, room & board) and learning that their kid is studying:

AFR 342—Racial Capitalism
AMST 219—Understanding Social Class
ENVI 103—Global Warming and Environmental Change

So-Sorry-935&