Sportsbook stories from the 90's. From degenrate to mature degenrate.

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Am I you, when you were me, way back when?

Todays episode of sportsbook stories from the 90's is to bought to you by a very good friend of us all and outstanding Las vegas radio show host John Kelly. John and I go back a long way and he has has always been a big supporter of my talents. I had not seen nor talked to him in several years and after a few minutes of catching up, he says once again, I have the gift of the gab and I should be doing radio. And you can now add that he thinks, as well as many others, that this thread should become a book. However what sparks this post tonite is the wonderful shout out he gave on the radio during the Money Talks Invitational show Friday when he told everyone at the end of it that I used to work at the Old Stardust. He does not know it, but its a comment that made me look/think about my past in a whole new way and it goes something like this...




Old Stardust??? In my mind the place never closed. It was a shock to hear it.
Why would this be a shock? Because when I look around, all the people who worked there are all still around, there all about my age, (42) and we didn't go anywhere. Seemingly nothing has changed in that regard. The hotel is gone, but the modern day Stardust fraternity is alive and well. So, hence, old didn't sound right at the time.


But old and gone it is. It made me feel like a part of history. A part of something no longer there, something from another time and place that people may want to hear stories about. I am not so sure. Stories that the many on the Las Vegas strip and beyond that I am aware I speak for whom have read this thread could tell themselves. If they wanted to. Which they dont. And I know it will never change. I am the only one willing to do any talking or story telling at all.


Which means if any of the stories of the time period and the collective stories that bring us to this point and time are ever going to get out to the greater general public....Its on me to do it???

Since when did I become the keeper of the flame and grand story teller?


Telling these stories in fourmdom to people whom deeply care about it all is one thing. The outside public is another. If JK gets his way,( he most likely wiil) it will happen. He knows the time has come for them to be told, if there ever going to be told, and he knows I am the one to do it and then some.

There is a sense of responsiblity and gravitis that goes along with that thought and it hit me square when I was at hooters listening to the show.



Once upon a time I was in my 20's chasing and trying to be like guys in there 40's, asking them to tell me stories and teach me the tricks of the trade along the way. Now I am in my 40's and find myself wondering if I am them now,when they were me then, way back when.

Days when youngters like me ran all over the strip trying to be wise guys like them, not having a clue or care at the time about the cold hard truths of living this life and the deep understandings of how it all works. Never thinking for a minute that one day things may come around full circle and you find that its yourself people are asking to hear stories from and teach certain tricks of the trade to.

In the end the gravitis of it all hit me heavily because I do know if I dont talk or tell any stories, no one else will.



All of this hit me at the same time after JK's shout out to me. I wanted to share these different emotions with everyone here because all of you in fourmdom are as much a part of these stories as anyone. Your great support as well as respect for me is one of the big reasons these stories we have right now were even written.
 
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Sugarbear....you were a no-show for the BASH at the Golden Nugget....what's up?

Living here in Thailand now...Roxy and Chuck Sharpe are here also...
 

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Sugarbear....you were a no-show for the BASH at the Golden Nugget....what's up?

Living here in Thailand now...Roxy and Chuck Sharpe are here also...


Been busier at work than ever. Still doing the same thing, but someplace else. The bash schedule did not work for me.

Thailand. Nice. Tell eveyone Juice says hello and feel free to write a story or two in this thread if they will.
 

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We have come full circle Ladies and Gentleman.

For those of you whom do not follow me on MW, I have been on a major leaue historical posting run, commenting on several things in our history at once. This run has made me reflect on the entire 10 year campaign of terror by the four major sports leauges and the DOJ. Along the way new insights and great understandings of things have unfolded in my mind and I will attempt in the next few threads to turn things around a bit in the crusade stories and try to give you look at what you looked like to me/us along the three major parts of the campaign. David Stern in his interview with S.I. where he says he is open to leagalized gambling, opened up the door for a flood of things. To bring you up to speed here is what I wrote on MW on the 31st as we entered the new decade.


This bombshell statement by David Stern just floored me. I TAKE THE CRUSADE YEARS (all 10 of them. 97-07) EXTREMELY PERSONALLY AND I COULD NOT BELIEVE THIS ABOUT FACE AT THE TIME.

"So we have morphed considerably in our corporate view where we say, Look, Las Vegas is not evil. Las Vegas is a vacation and destination resort, and they have sports gambling and, in fact, there's a federal statute that gives them a monopoly of types [on sports betting]. And we actually supported that statute back in '92."



Versus, as taken from the Vegas Crusade Stories...They started with Vegas first part 1. A combination of...


"Senator McCain said something or made a speech or more correctly started making speeches about how sportsbetting was corrupting America and then somewhere along the way blamed the rise in popularity of offshore sports betting on Las vegas because we wetted your appetite to gamble on games making the offshores irresitable. Therefore it had to be outlawed to save the childern and protect Americas values against nefarious criminal underworld types that prey on the unsuspecting and naive thus destroying there lives."


Plus,"There central argument was that if we outlaw sportsbetting in Vegas this will drasticaly reduce the public appetite for betting these games. They also went for outlawing point spreads in the papers and other mediums to. They said point spreads and the like encoraged people to bet illegally so it had to be resrticted". If they cant see it ot or access it they wont want to bet the games. They were serious folks.


TALK ABOUT COMING FULL CIRCLE.


Well, well, well ladies and gentleman of the gaming community, I, Mr Ground Zero from the Vegas Crusade Years himself, would never have thought he would live the to see the day that ANYONE,much less a commisioner of the 4 major sports leauges, would ever say the above or even dare mention supporting sportsbetting.


It has sparked me unreal and put my agenda in motion way earlier than I had planned. It has taken me all the way till tonite to collect my thoughts on this bomb shell and share my insights on it all.


I would say no one in the Stardust fratenity during the crusade years ever thought the day would come.


Never.



Full version here. http://www.majorwager.com/forums/me...tting-rule-changes.html?highlight=David+Stern




Now what made David go and say all this I wonder.


1.The numbers are in already and they are bad. The essence being that all team salary caps are going to be going down, not up, for the next few years at least. With a potential quadruaple witching in the offing maybe....

You better start talking fast or at least like you are looking for revenue sources somewhere to get back the money. Its not so much that the players will balk at reduced salaries and the like, its that you are going to lose players and talent at the top and bottom of the pools due to money, which lessens the talent playing, which devalues the product, which devalues everything else and so on and so on. The 4 major sports leauges are in a major deflationary loop which is a VERY DIFFICULT thing to stop once it gets going.



2. Due to the referee scandal, David has not only developed a great working relationship with key people in the oddsmaking/bookmaking fraternity here in Vegas as well as abroad, but a serious woking knowledge of how it all works.
This of course includes the people on his short list of successors as well.


Think of it as sportsbetting/sportsbooking.net. Virutal money and screens to watch all the theorectical action and learn how to do and spot a variety of things so that when the time comes to broach the subject of leagalized sportsbetting in america, one is as well versed in the different "processes" and thus is able to "monitor" effectivly the various going ons inside as well as outside of the leauge and inside as well as OUTSIDE the country as it relates to your product.

The NBA is far ahead of the rest in this regard I believe and only needs to figure out what lingo it wants to use to bring it about in america and in what is obvious to me by Davids comments, bring about an international expansion/ gaming agenda well.



What does it all mean???? It means....


Congraulations one and all. After all these live long decades OUR MONEY is finally GOOD. No way,shut your mouth Juice. Way I say.

NOW THEY WILL TAKE IT. Now that they face a serious downward sprial, NOW, we are good enough to entertain and talk to.

When exactly did they figure out that good times, bad tmes, or any ole time, people will bet the games and jump thru hoops to bet them regardless?

When you see all that virtual money come in on all those virtual games on all your different virtual screens you have access to around the world, even in this era of greatly reduced revenues, YOUR EYES HAVE TO LIGHT UP AT THE NUMBERS WHEN YOU SEE THEM, THATS WHEN.



Our backs for over 4 score of years now was good for nothing more than the 4 major sports leauges to crusade off of. All so that they could build solid careers, accumulate wealth, accumulate power and get people elected so that they can continue to do those same 4 things without undue interuption time to no end.

WELL IT READS HERE...THE END IS HERE.

When you turn to those you have villified for 70+ years now and ask them to help save you and your oh so precious sports leauges....

THATS THE END. THE GAME IS OVER. BIG TIME.


From none other than Mr Ground Zero himself we now start turning this whole 70 year charade around and start working together to help build A WORLDWIDE INTEGRATED GAMING SOCIETY.
 

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The Irrational Left and the Ridicoulous Right join Forces.

So, so many different "little" memories are floating back to me now that I know that all of this has come full circle. And not memories per say, but remembering the attitude about you/us, some things that were said, what swung the war our way, etc. This is an attempt to give you a look through my eyes what you/it all looked like to me at the time and the part I felt you played in the lets ban it all portion of the terror campaign of 97-00.



YOU DID NOT EXIST.



You of course existed in some cude way, but, in what is a blend of converstations and vauge rememberances, it came in my mind to be understood in that at some point back in 93/94 a report or two came out saying that in effect, guys they had tailed/chased/put away in Vegas, plus a few others, had shown up at offshore locals, found some of there old friends and were back up to there old tricks again.


I talk about this in sportsbook stories. After everything was said and done in Vegas and the last of the street crowd element was finally removed from the sportsbooks, (not) both sides found themselves to be about the same age and with a lot of time left on the clock. One group after about a year or two of wondering around, went to go see some fiends of theres in the islands, the others followed after awhile because the western union reports showed ever increasing amounts leaving the country to locals and from locals in an ever widening range and the feds wanted to investigate.


It is my guess since they knew whom the people out there were, that they started sending/assigning people you knew from the old days, if you will, to keep an eye on you and as history now reveals, watch you build with AMERICAN MONEY, the start of the offshore empire.


The first question was, is and shall always be, is that if they were so worried about the offshores popularity, why din't Clinton go after them or western union from jump in 92/93?


Because Clinton and company had flagrant diregard and disrespect for the criminals those before them had chased out there and felt you were not only exiled and isolated, but brefet of any intelligence and nothing but bottom feeders. They really had no regard for you. You did not exist in any real way for a long time. Like 85 percent of Clintons first term you did not exist. I am sure that the oddsmakers they went after first, would agree with this assesment.


You did not graduate to criminal and nefarious underworld types until they started going after the oddsmakes for, AIDING AND ABETTING an illegal criminal empire. More or less. They were "taking a look at it" is more like it.
It "can help aid" and it "can help abet" an illegal criminal empire and here is that phrase again, THEREFORE IT MUST BE BANNED. WTF!!!!


Of course we said, we can work with you and help you to police it. We can teach you whats going on, what to look for and what to do.


Fuck you says the Fed in effect. We will outlaw points spreads not only from being printed in the paper (the first thing they tried) but from being created at all. This will stop america from wanting to bet on games and they will never trust a line from an offshore local once you are gone becuase there is no reliable source to make one legally.

What! They couldn't believe america would say ok the feds dont approve we wont go online and get point spreads and bet anymore.


They did and for along time at that. For the most part I guess they thought you couldn't make spreads, but the screens when I got to work at 7:00 am pacciffic time most days or at least in the later days, had numbers on games already. The only blank spots were the Vegas book ones.



I am completly clueless as to who or what would be hanging and moving all those numbers on the screens in those days. Were you invisible? Swimming? Fishing? In my old age (43) I have forgotten much. Can anyone help me remember please?


To be continued...
 

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Thall shall not bet games says the Big Bad Fed. ROTFLMAO!

Fuck you says the Fed in effect. We will outlaw points spreads not only from being printed in the paper (the first thing they tried) but from being created at all. This will stop america from wanting to bet on games and they will never trust a line from an offshore local once you are gone becuase there is no reliable source to make one legally.


What! They couldn't believe america would say ok the feds dont approve we wont go online and get point spreads and bet anymore.


They did and for along time at that. For the most part I guess they thought you couldn't make spreads, but the screens when I got to work at 7:00 am pacciffic time most days or at least in the later days, had numbers on games already. The only blank spots were the Vegas book ones.



I am completly clueless as to who or what would be hanging and moving all those numbers on the screens in those days. Were you invisible? Swimming? Fishing? In my old age (43) I have forgotten much. Can anyone help me remember please?


To be continued...






Its not so much that you did not exist as much as you were resented for existing at all. In my view the Vegas onslaught was an attempt to do what they should have done when they finally got around to cleaning up the sportsbooks in the late 80's. And thats just wrap it up all right there under RICO. In retrospect they should have included points spreads in that because the "it can help abet" and " it can help aid" criminal empires. They got bookies elvated to felons and then linked them to everything in that law to make them look like mobsters in control of it all. Too bad they left the gun the mobsters killed everyone with behind. TYPICAL FED FORMULA. LOCK UP THE BAD GUYS AND LEAVE THE TOOLS BEHIND SO WE CAN PERSECUTE THE NEXT GENERATION THAT COMES ALONG AND USES THEM. Oh so silly us in good ole LAS VEGAS to think that, that could not mean in a place where it is lawful and legal to do so, now could it?


Once things got started which is seemingly sometime during foorball in 97, it went fast. The feds in my opinion had momentum on there side. People in the greater US it seemed was all for the elimination of point spreads. Many newspapers at the time dumped them if I am not mistaken.


However they attacked the oddsmaker proffesion period and its where it gets personal. I am talking mostly about Roxy Roxbourgh and Ken White, but there are many others that come with them and of course we are all friends. Really more like family. Its well beyond just helping us put out americas line. After a time you know just as much about that person as they do about you. A bond does develop.



ITS WHERE IT STARTS ITS WHERE IT MUST STOP THEY SAID IN EFFECT.


In one way you feel helpless. You read in the papers what they are saying they are going to do and it certainly sounds like they are getting close, very close in fact. When you are 31, making 10 dollars an hour and on the will be a major #1 or a # 2 somehwere track it makes you feel disregarded and insignifigant. Brushed aside so to speak and not just me.


WE USED YOU TO OUR UTTER ADVANTAGE AND CONTINUED TO BEAT THE FEDS OVER THE HEAD WITH THE FACT THAT HEY WHO'S GOING TO STOP THEM. WHO IS GOING TO PROTECT YOUR CHILDERN FROM LOOKING THINGS UP ON THE COMPUTER. PROTECT THE INTEGRITY OF THE ATHLETIC COMPETIONS.



Senator John Kyl thats who. WHERE DID ONE AND ALL THINK HE GOT THE IDEA TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT THAT "COMPUTER THING." STILL AT IN FACT. (Italian Cookies anyone?) EVIL OR EVIL? Surprised aren't you/




They were getting killed with it. The screaming matches I heard about were unreal. Some newspapers and more like a lot it seemed threatned to print off the offshore line and print it anyway. And for good measure threw in a lets go the freedom of speech route and see what you do. AND there is no law about printing things off the computer. NOW THAT PUT A CHILL IN THE FEDS ASS REAL QUICK. I cant remember the time sequence of all that exactly, but, at some point they changed tatics and just solely focused on getting rid of the "Vegas" oddsmakers.



THE OLD ONE BATTLE AT A TIME TRICK. OR DONT INVITE MORE PEOPLE INTO A FIGHT THAN YOU CAN BEAT. It worked to the best of memeory. Swung the media back round there way enough to make it seem like that change in tatics worked. It certainly seemed like it to me. MORE INTENSE. MORE FOCUSED. SCARIER ONCE IT PICKED UP AGAIN.



In the end its akin to a close family memeber that lives somehwere else and is on trial for something. Everything said about them, is the same as saying it about you and you feel every bit of it. Only add, if they go, you go to. There were times it seemed we were unable to help defend. And I mean your three principal point guards when I say we in, Robert Walker, Joe Lupo and Art Mantaris. There are many more, but those three and especially Robert, were on lead all 6 years of the FEDS utter and brutal beat down by LAS VEGAS.



Next Up...A look at your pre toddleristic years of 98-99.
 

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Todays episode of sportsbook stories from the 90's is to bought to you by a very good friend of us all and outstanding Las vegas radio show host John Kelly. John and I go back a long way and he has has always been a big supporter of my talents. I had not seen nor talked to him in several years and after a few minutes of catching up, he says once again, I have the gift of the gab and I should be doing radio. And you can now add that he thinks, as well as many others, that this thread should become a book. However what sparks this post tonite is the wonderful shout out he gave on the radio during the Money Talks Invitational show Friday when he told everyone at the end of it that I used to work at the Old Stardust. He does not know it, but its a comment that made me look/think about my past in a whole new way and it goes something like this...




Old Stardust??? In my mind the place never closed. It was a shock to hear it.
Why would this be a shock? Because when I look around, all the people who worked there are all still around, there all about my age, (42) and we didn't go anywhere. Seemingly nothing has changed in that regard. The hotel is gone, but the modern day Stardust fraternity is alive and well. So, hence, old didn't sound right at the time.


But old and gone it is. It made me feel like a part of history. A part of something no longer there, something from another time and place that people may want to hear stories about. I am not so sure. Stories that the many on the Las Vegas strip and beyond that I am aware I speak for whom have read this thread could tell themselves. If they wanted to. Which they dont. And I know it will never change. I am the only one willing to do any talking or story telling at all.


Which means if any of the stories of the time period and the collective stories that bring us to this point and time are ever going to get out to the greater general public....Its on me to do it???

Since when did I become the keeper of the flame and grand story teller?


Telling these stories in fourmdom to people whom deeply care about it all is one thing. The outside public is another. If JK gets his way,( he most likely wiil) it will happen. He knows the time has come for them to be told, if there ever going to be told, and he knows I am the one to do it and then some.

There is a sense of responsiblity and gravitis that goes along with that thought and it hit me square when I was at hooters listening to the show.



Once upon a time I was in my 20's chasing and trying to be like guys in there 40's, asking them to tell me stories and teach me the tricks of the trade along the way. Now I am in my 40's and find myself wondering if I am them now,when they were me then, way back when.

Days when youngters like me ran all over the strip trying to be wise guys like them, not having a clue or care at the time about the cold hard truths of living this life and the deep understandings of how it all works. Never thinking for a minute that one day things may come around full circle and you find that its yourself people are asking to hear stories from and teach certain tricks of the trade to.

In the end the gravitis of it all hit me heavily because I do know if I dont talk or tell any stories, no one else will.



All of this hit me at the same time after JK's shout out to me. I wanted to share these different emotions with everyone here because all of you in fourmdom are as much a part of these stories as anyone. Your great support as well as respect for me is one of the big reasons these stories we have right now were even written.






Well the end of era is here ladies and gentleman and the times have changed BIG TIME and soon things will be very different than they are today. Truly Extroridnary things have finally happned and the era of the World Wide Race and Sports Exchanges is now in session. Before I go, as is my right, I have let go of all the things in the past that have bought us here today and have made sincere apologys to all involved in what has been a long 14 years for me and a total 80 year war has come to end. You can read my smartest guys in the room writeups if you want to make all the easy money you want + interest sitting on your ass while earning it. It is in no means goodbye, its just goodbye for a few minutes and before you know it, it will all behind you.






So with out further ado, I none other than Juice himself now Capitan of a Brand New Ship called GREAT, GREAT, STUFF:

Do herby forgive the following and all other associated peoples for putting me and my kind, the 10 dollar an hour class, not even half that in th islands, through positive hell.


It all seems so pre crashy thingy ago now, it makes you wonder where the time goes. It has been 14 years since the start of this begining of the end interputed, ha, ha, ha, twice along the way.
blowup.gif



Sen John McCain and John Kyl. The very bains of my existence through all this and the source of much and now FORMER, anger issue, issues, I forgive you the most, because I have said the most about you and well...wait for the rewrite, please.
thumbup.gif
I am sorry for taking it personal. I know its just buisness. I really do. Sorry.


As for the rest, Presidents Bill Clinton and George Bush, DOJ heads, Janet Reno and Roberto Gonzales, THE Southern District of New York, we have to hand it to you, you are truly tenacious and very good at what you do. And last but not least, Katherine Hannway, whom I wil note right here,
that you did get the right company in BOS and we got a much better offshore society because of it. We thank you dearly. It s the number 1 thing that gets me here to day and by extension into a....


Brand New World Wide Gaming Exchange World.



Dreams do really come true.
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Sugarbear,

Where are your Smartest Guys in the Room writeups posted? I'm interested in reading them.
 

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First of all most of this is not my story to tell but I can give you a view from the bottom and try to impart to you what things were like when Senator McCain went on his crusade and tried to outlaw sportsbetting in Las Vegas.
Please note some views expressed were not always shared by all and that this is the first time I have ever spoken about this time period so I dont know where I am going exactly. It was an emotional time both times.



It was 97 if I remember correctly and it started rather quietly as I remember.
Senator McCain said something or made a speech or more correctly started making speeches about how sportsbetting was corrupting America and then somewhere along the way blamed the rise in popularity of offshore sports betting on Las vegas because we wetted your appetite to gamble on games making the offshores irresitable. Therefore it had to be outlawed to save the childern and protect Americas values against nefarious criminal underworld types that prey on the unsuspecting and naive thus destroying there lives.


Now lets all get one thing straight right here before I move on. The Feds drove the Vegas Old Guard into obscurity leaving those who valued there jobs plus the new ones to police the gambling community and fill out all the paper work. We get the whole place cleaned up, the Feds are long gone and now chasing them in earnest offshore since they had nothing else to do. It was to early for there retirement and the usual suspects from the 70's and 80's were up to there ususal tricks and theres nothing like hanging out with your friends and getting some R and R after running around after them in hot ass Vegas all those years. Can you imagine the stories?


Anyhow so now that the dirty work is done and Vegas as a whole is regulated
they turn around and now blame us for the countrys ills because we do a good job and all want to be like us. Of course they go after sportsbetting because that what they have always gone after first. They chased them from NY, Clevland, Chicago, Texas and other places over it right to Vegas and right onto an island. (A few here lived thru it all and I would love to hear from.) This is what regulation is. They stop accuasing you of being a criminal with them and turn around and make everything you do look criminal and sinister with intent to destroy american values and the other bullshit we can repaeat by heart. (Plus a slew of corprate stuff I will reveal later.)

When that hit the roof came right off. How dare these stupid fucking piecies of shit turn around and accuse us of moral wrong doing after ONE, PUTTIING US IN POWER AFTER 2. CHASING THE VERY ONES OUT OF THE COUNTRY WHOM ARE NOW DOING BUISNESS AS USUAL. Its our fault you drove them away starting 60 years ago? So its our fault we did our jobs, played by the rules and made things safe for pepole. We did all this for what?


SO YOU COULD TURN AROUND AND VICTIMIZE US?!! There central argument was that if we outlaw sportsbetting in Vegas this will drasticaly reduce the public appetite for betting these games. They also went for outlawing point spreads in the papers and other mediums to. They said point spreads and the like encoraged people to bet illegally so it had to be resrticted. If they cant see it ot or access it they wont want to bet the games. They were serious folks. Now I worked at the Dust. You know the people who put out Americas line. How do you think that went over behind the counter? Joe Lupo was the lead guy in the first fight and had a few things to say about the....of the people in power. People really believed that was going to happen and that there would be no more schedule or odds to see or anything. The Gov had its Mojo on and all the leauges were behind it and honestly believed the offshores would follow suit. In total we were incredulous over some stuff that was said the first time around Joe Lupo the most of all. He beat down every silly little thing that McCain said. They pressed the suppression will work plus banning sportsbetting in Vegas as the answer and were making leeway or so they thought. Bottom line people were scared. Very scared.


The phrase ALL INFORMATION IS FOR NEWS MATTER ONLY AND IS NOT INTENEDED TO VIOLATE ANY LOCAL,STATE OR FEDREAL LAWS was born of this attempt to ban publishing of pointspreads and the like. In the end sportsbooks get people into the casino and they were not going for that crap and this was the compromise that came out of it. Before 98 that phrase did not exist as well as a couple of others I will reveal later.

This is what regulation is. Someone regulating something that is already regulated to make it look like there doing there job right on down to me at the bottom. The guy who does the work, has to make things work. :103631605


To be continued!

Ahhh here we all are. Just over 21 years after McCain said he was shutting all down. Its been a long journey.

Things were so much simpler then..
 

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Wow, Sugarbear is alive. He makes an appearance off a long layoff. How the hell did you remember your password after all this time?
 
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As a kid when I gambled on sports I had to be with this local where a win in NBA was by 6 points or more. Or if you wanted to bet the game will be within 5 points either way you can do that. Do you have any idea how incredibly hard it is to win? No, not hard, damn near impossible. It upsets me thinking of all the games I lost taking a -400 favorite where they won but only won by 4 or 5 or sometimes on a buzzer beater. This should have been an exciting winning wager for me but with this local it was a loss. So many losses. If I played the spread the spreads were always way off from what favored my style of betting.

In NHL if the game went to overtime and I took them to win, it would be a loss even if they won in ot which is considered a tie with that local.

What a foolish kid I was. But I loved sports and I loved gambling. At least the money I wager was chump change in the big scheme of things.

When I discovered offshore betting in my 20s I thought I found the city of Oz.
 

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So, so many different "little" memories are floating back to me now that I know that all of this has come full circle. And not memories per say, but remembering the attitude about you/us, some things that were said, what swung the war our way, etc. This is an attempt to give you a look through my eyes what you/it all looked like to me at the time and the part I felt you played in the lets ban it all portion of the terror campaign of 97-00.



YOU DID NOT EXIST.



You of course existed in some cude way, but, in what is a blend of converstations and vauge rememberances, it came in my mind to be understood in that at some point back in 93/94 a report or two came out saying that in effect, guys they had tailed/chased/put away in Vegas, plus a few others, had shown up at offshore locals, found some of there old friends and were back up to there old tricks again.


I talk about this in sportsbook stories. After everything was said and done in Vegas and the last of the street crowd element was finally removed from the sportsbooks, (not) both sides found themselves to be about the same age and with a lot of time left on the clock. One group after about a year or two of wondering around, went to go see some fiends of theres in the islands, the others followed after awhile because the western union reports showed ever increasing amounts leaving the country to locals and from locals in an ever widening range and the feds wanted to investigate.


It is my guess since they knew whom the people out there were, that they started sending/assigning people you knew from the old days, if you will, to keep an eye on you and as history now reveals, watch you build with AMERICAN MONEY, the start of the offshore empire.


The first question was, is and shall always be, is that if they were so worried about the offshores popularity, why din't Clinton go after them or western union from jump in 92/93?


Because Clinton and company had flagrant diregard and disrespect for the criminals those before them had chased out there and felt you were not only exiled and isolated, but brefet of any intelligence and nothing but bottom feeders. They really had no regard for you. You did not exist in any real way for a long time. Like 85 percent of Clintons first term you did not exist. I am sure that the oddsmakers they went after first, would agree with this assesment.


You did not graduate to criminal and nefarious underworld types until they started going after the oddsmakes for, AIDING AND ABETTING an illegal criminal empire. More or less. They were "taking a look at it" is more like it.
It "can help aid" and it "can help abet" an illegal criminal empire and here is that phrase again, THEREFORE IT MUST BE BANNED. WTF!!!!


Of course we said, we can work with you and help you to police it. We can teach you whats going on, what to look for and what to do.


Fuck you says the Fed in effect. We will outlaw points spreads not only from being printed in the paper (the first thing they tried) but from being created at all. This will stop america from wanting to bet on games and they will never trust a line from an offshore local once you are gone becuase there is no reliable source to make one legally.

What! They couldn't believe america would say ok the feds dont approve we wont go online and get point spreads and bet anymore.


They did and for along time at that. For the most part I guess they thought you couldn't make spreads, but the screens when I got to work at 7:00 am pacciffic time most days or at least in the later days, had numbers on games already. The only blank spots were the Vegas book ones.



I am completly clueless as to who or what would be hanging and moving all those numbers on the screens in those days. Were you invisible? Swimming? Fishing? In my old age (43) I have forgotten much. Can anyone help me remember please?


To be continued...


I am feeling my oats big time right now. From it "can aid and abet" an illegal criminal empire, to billions are going to come from the credit shop sky's and into governments lap.

I
 

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