President Dummy Laureate puts US on brink of Iraq return

[Acebb]

WASHINGTON (AP) — After years of resisting the pull of more Mideast conflicts, President Barack Obama is ready to return the United States to military action in Iraq, the very country where he accused his predecessor of engaging in a "dumb war."

The president's authorization of airstrikes against militants in Iraq threatens to upend his legacy as the commander in chief who ended the long, unpopular war which killed nearly 4,500 American troops. It also raises fresh questions about whether Obama's desire to end that conflict clouded his assessment of the risks of fully withdrawing U.S. troops, as well as his judgment about the threat posed by the Islamic extremists who have taken advantage of a vulnerable Iraq.

http://news.yahoo.com/ap-analysis-o...-072319764.html;_ylt=AwrBJSBgqORTs1kAH8HQtDMD

Note: this abject idiot has decided to act after hundreds have been killed, thousands have had to flee their homes, and a total humanitarian crisis has begun.

 

[Acebb]

“What we were looking for was an Iraq that was secure, stable, and self-reliant, and that’s what we got here, so there’s no question that was a success,” said then-Deputy National Security Advisor Denis McDonough, now White House chief of staff, in October 2011, on the day the complete withdrawal was announced.



"We knew this day would come. We've known it for some time. But still there is something profound about the end of a war that has lasted so long," said Obama. "It's harder to end a war than begin one. Everything that American troops have done in Iraq - all the fighting, all the dying, the bleeding and the building and the training and the partnering, all of it has landed to this moment of success."
...
Iraq's not a perfect place. It has many challenges ahead. But we're leaving behind a sovereign, stable and self reliant Iraq with a representative government that was elected by its people. We're building a new partnership between our nations and we are ending a war not with a final battle but with a final march toward home. This is an extraordinary achievement," he said.

Loser!@#0

This crisis is entirely Obama's fault.

 

[MantisToboggan]

This crisis is entirely Obama's fault.

Hardly. Saddam Hussein was a stabilizing force in the Middle East. President Obama is not responsible for his removal.

 

[Acebb]

Hardly. Saddam Hussein was a stabilizing force in the Middle East. President Obama is not responsible for his removal.

Uh, you might want to read Obama's own words about how stable Iraq was and how he decided to remove the US presence.

Saddam was so 'stable' that the US was spending ~$3 billion a year and committing almost 20,000 personnel and 500 aircraft to enforce a no-fly zone to contain him.

You need better responses.

 

[hehateme82]

Uh, you might want to read Obama's own words about how stable Iraq was and how he decided to remove the US presence.

Saddam was so 'stable' that the US was spending ~$3 billion a year and committing almost 20,000 personnel and 500 aircraft to enforce a no-fly zone to contain him.

You need better responses.

I'm pretty sure $3 Billion a year to keep Saddam at check was better than the $2 Trillion War plus thousands of American lives to remove him from power.

 

[ScottL]

IMO thread topic is unfair. Ace if Obama had continued to do nothing you would have rightfully criticized him. And now he is doing the right thing and your criticizing him. Yeah he's fucked up in Iraq and on his foreign policy. And yeah he tiptoed in his speech and said it was about protecting our servicemen, implying he'd do nothing if it were only about the potential slaughter of 200,000 people who aren't radical islamists. And there would be no mission creep blah blah blah. Still, you gotta give him and the joint chiefs credit for getting something planned and done in two days.

 

[ScottL]

I agree with Ace that Saddam had to go. I refuse to discuss that cocksucker again. Good riddance!

And I love the irony of Obama authorizing military jets to take off from the aircraft carrier George Bush to strike ISIS

 

[Acebb]

I'm pretty sure $3 Billion a year to keep Saddam at check was better than the $2 Trillion War plus thousands of American lives to remove him from power.

can I get a cite for the $2 Trillion figure?

Here is how bogged down America was, since 1991:

After the Gulf War ended in 1991, Hussein began massacring Iraqi Kurds and Shiites who, with U.S. encouragement, had risen up against him. As in Libya, the massacres were blamed in part on the Iraqi leader’s air superiority, including helicopters. To counter this, and to send a message that the world would not stand idly by, the United States and its allies enforced a no-fly zone over northern Iraq. Hussein pulled back in the north but continued to slaughter Iraqi Shiites, leading to the creation in 1992 of a similar no-fly zone in southern Iraq. In 1994, concerned about Iraqi military aggression against Kuwait, the United States established a no-drive zone in southern Iraq. During this time, the United States also bombed Iraq’s air defenses that threatened patrolling allied aircraft, hoping to shake its foundations and topple its dictator.

That went on for 13 years. 200 military planes, 19 naval ships and 22,000 American military personnel committed to enforcing the "no-fly zones"

How much longer was it supposed to last?

 

[Acebb]

IMO thread topic is unfair. Ace if Obama had continued to do nothing you would have rightfully criticized him. And now he is doing the right thing and your criticizing him. Yeah he's fucked up in Iraq and on his foreign policy. And yeah he tiptoed in his speech and said it was about protecting our servicemen, implying he'd do nothing if it were only about the potential slaughter of 200,000 people who aren't radical islamists. And there would be no mission creep blah blah blah. Still, you gotta give him and the joint chiefs credit for getting something planned and done in two days.

The issue is that the WH was warned in January this would happen and we got:

[As recently as January, Obama was publicly dismissive of the Islamic State group, which at the time was under the al-Qaida banner. In an interview with the New Yorker magazine, he said comparing the upstart group to the terror network established by Osama bin Laden was like comparing a jayvee basketball team to an NBA squad.]

:>(

 

[hehateme82]

can I get a cite for the $2 Trillion figure?

Here is how bogged down America was, since 1991:

After the Gulf War ended in 1991, Hussein began massacring Iraqi Kurds and Shiites who, with U.S. encouragement, had risen up against him. As in Libya, the massacres were blamed in part on the Iraqi leader’s air superiority, including helicopters. To counter this, and to send a message that the world would not stand idly by, the United States and its allies enforced a no-fly zone over northern Iraq. Hussein pulled back in the north but continued to slaughter Iraqi Shiites, leading to the creation in 1992 of a similar no-fly zone in southern Iraq. In 1994, concerned about Iraqi military aggression against Kuwait, the United States established a no-drive zone in southern Iraq. During this time, the United States also bombed Iraq’s air defenses that threatened patrolling allied aircraft, hoping to shake its foundations and topple its dictator.

That went on for 13 years. 200 military planes, 19 naval ships and 22,000 American military personnel committed to enforcing the "no-fly zones"

How much longer was it supposed to last?

(Reuters) - The U.S. war in Iraq has cost $1.7 trillion with an additional $490 billion in benefits owed to war veterans, expenses that could grow to more than $6 trillion over the next four decades counting interest, a study released on Thursday said.
The war has killed at least 134,000 Iraqi civilians and may have contributed to the deaths of as many as four times that number, according to the Costs of War Project by the Watson Institute for International Studies at Brown University.
When security forces, insurgents, journalists and humanitarian workers were included, the war's death toll rose to an estimated 176,000 to 189,000, the study said.

The report, the work of about 30 academics and experts, was published in advance of the 10th anniversary of the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq on March 19, 2003.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/03/14/us-iraq-war-anniversary-idUSBRE92D0PG20130314

 

[Acebb]

"9 civilians were killed & 61 wounded following US airstrikes on the Islamic state"

"ISIS members are calling for attacks on US interests worldwide after start of airstrikes in Iraq."

^That's war.

 

[Acebb]

Ok, so we have 1 estimate at 2 trillion and another at 800 billion

I'm not clear why the cost matters.

 

[ScottL]

"9 civilians were killed & 61 wounded following US airstrikes on the Islamic state"

"ISIS members are calling for attacks on US interests worldwide after start of airstrikes in Iraq."

^That's war.

No civilians as far as I'm concerned. These are either people aligned with ISIS or already kidnapped by ISIS. Either way their lives were finished.

 

[Dave007inVegas]

Hardly. Saddam Hussein was a stabilizing force in the Middle East. President Obama is not responsible for his removal.

Maybe you’d like to inform the people of Kuwait, somehow I don’t think they would agree.

 

[hehateme82]

Ok, so we have 1 estimate at 2 trillion and another at 800 billion

I'm not clear why the cost matters.

I was just stating it was more efficient to spend the $3 Billion a year with multiple no fly zones and keeping Saddam in check than the alternative which was a full out war. We can't win a war in these types of countries, it just doesn't work. Look at the Axis in WW2, we fucked them up and now are allies with all of them. We will never be allies with these people because they have so many factions that are just batshit crazy and want to kill and destroy regardless of who is power. I'm all about strategic airstrikes to help defend innocent civilians from these animals... US should have done it months ago.. but no fucking way should we risk more American lives with a ground invasion in any of these shitholes.

 

[Acebb]

I was just stating it was more efficient to spend the $3 Billion a year with multiple no fly zones and keeping Saddam in check than the alternative which was a full out war. We can't win a war in these types of countries, it just doesn't work. Look at the Axis in WW2, we fucked them up and now are allies with all of them. We will never be allies with these people because they have so many factions that are just batshit crazy and want to kill and destroy regardless of who is power. I'm all about strategic airstrikes to help defend innocent civilians from these animals... US should have done it months ago.. but no fucking way should we risk more American lives with a ground invasion in any of these shitholes.

With the benefit of some hindsight, you're likely right.

It doesn't appear that the average Iraqi has much interest or guts in defending their own country. Additionally, Bush and his advisors were way too optimistic regarding the ability and desire of these people to embrace any sort of representative government and solving political issues without guns.

Perhaps we should have bombed Baghdad after 9/11, put more a strangle hold on the country until Saddam was killed or we found a way to get him out.

 

[Acebb]

The World Will Blame President Obama if Iraq Falls


The world will not blame the Iraqi government if the children and women huddled atop Mount Sinjar in northern Iraq die of hunger and exposure. Nor will Pope Francis blame Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki if the Islamic extremists attacking the country slaughter the 40,000 Christians and other minorities who have fled to the mountaintop. The fact is that the world, from the pontiff in the Vatican to the coal miner in West Virginia, will blame President Obama.
That is why the president found himself under such intense pressure to act on Thursday, facing calls from around the world to marshal American might in a way to both rush humanitarian aid to the refugees in Iraq and punish the forces of the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS) who are trying to kill them.

http://www.nationaljournal.com/whit...-blame-president-obama-if-iraq-falls-20140807

 

[Acebb]

Joe Biden bragging what an achievement Obama made regarding Iraq

 

[Acebb]

FACT: President Obama kept his promise to end the war in Iraq. Romney called the decision to bring our troops home “tragic.”— Barack Obama (@BarackObama) October 22, 2012

 

[Acebb]