Oregon

[cloverleaf]

Interesting take on the Oregon Ducks by Matt Hayes. Take a look...........

Money makes everything better. Before Nike king Phil Knight got involved, Oregon was an afterthought of a program. Now the Ducks, with Knight's money and state-of-the-art facilities, are one of the hottest names in college sports. The brand that Knight built with cash and with coaches Mike Bellotti, Chip Kelly and Mark Helfrich have developed on the field and has allowed this program to rise among the elite despite its less-than-average recruiting base in the Northwest. The brand is so good that Oregon recruits successfully on a national level.

Some excellent points by Mr. Hayes. Guess my question would be...Can money buy/win a national football championship? Welcome your comments.........................

 

[REDEYE]

money can put you in the conversation for a championship... after that , you need a little luck, and have certain things go your way....Recruiting is getting better... I see we got a 4* OLB for 2016 that picked us over USC....15 years ago that wouldn't have happened...Last year was a perfect example of how it can be done.....luck wasn't on our side...to many skilled players were out for the championship game...Offense was hamstrung...Ohio St was a great team.... we still might have lost.. I'm sure the two fools on this forum will come in here and dispute this with the usual nonsense

 

[cloverleaf]

Red Eye, I agree it takes some "luck" especially key players avoiding injury. The key to me is
the head coach and his staff. Teams don't win a national championship without great coaching.
Oregon started that with Bellotti, improved with Kelly and replaced Kelly with what looks to be
a winner in Helfrich. Great coaches + great players = great opportunity.

 

[REDEYE]

I'm not sure Helfrich will ever be considered a great coach. But he did a great job ly with all of the injuries to the OL and the WR positions to get us to the championship game..

 

[BigdaddyQH]

Red Eye, you are making excuses for a dismal failure in the NC game against Ohio State. Oregon got it's tail kicked big time. Oregon was the recipient of four turnovers but could only score 10 points off of those turnovers. They got their butts kicked in the 4th quarter. This is so typical Oregon. They choke under pressure, just like they chocked in the game against Auburn. Oregon loses this game no matter who is or is not injured. I agree that Helfrich is not in the class of Kelly or Bellotti.

As far as recruiting is concerned, Oregon is still miles behind USC and always will be. Oregon does a very good job for what it is, a school with a gimick offense that has won games, but never the big one. They have replaced UDub as the #1 school in what is not the Pac 12 North, but Oregon is still far behind USC when it comes to recruiting. Last year USC was rankewd 1 or 2 in recruiting. Oregon was 16 or 17. Considering that Oregon was coming off a 13-2 season with the last loss coming in the NC game, and USC finished at 9-4, if Oregon could not come close to out recruiting USC, they never will. Just like they never have, or will win an NC. Ask any Alabama fan. Ask any Ohio State fan. Ask any USC fan. National Champions have a certain attitude about them. A certain "strut" if you will. Oregon has never had that and never will. The toughest NC to win is the first one.

Red, what you have to start doing is looking for answers, NOT excuses. You are a great excuse maker, but all that gets you is a bunch of Kleenex. NO more excuses. There is NO excuse for a 42-20 loss. There is NO excuse for scoring 10 points off of 4 turnover recoveries. If I were you, I would be giving some serious thought to how Oregon defeats Michigan State, because a loss to MSU makes it very difficult to qualify for the Playoffs. It will be very difficult to qualify for the playoffs with two losses, and that is what Oregon is looking at if they lose to MSU. With games at Arizona State, UDub, and Stanford, plus at least one game vs USC, it is going to be very difficult for Oregon to go undefeated in the Conference. A loss to MSU automatically puts Oregon behind the Big 10 Champ. There is a strong possibility that two Big 12 teams have 0 or 1 loss each. The SEC still commands the most respect out of any of the power 5 conferences. By the way, the same scenario applies to every Pac 12 team. USC has to get past Notre Dame at the Dome. No Pac 12 team can afford a loss to a non-con opponent.

 

[REDEYE]

1 fool in, 1 to go

 

[cloverleaf]

Red Eye, I didn't want to get involved while you where waiting on No. 2 adversary to respond... but while waiting on another response, I'd still like to pose the question of the thread for others:

Can money win/buy a national championship in college football?

 

[TyBounce]

There's no doubt that Phil Knight's contributions helped get Oregon "branded" and got them to a level they had never been before ... BUT ... Oregon is no longer some tricked up overnight sensation , they have been good enough now for long enough now , that if/when they win a nc it will be earned not bought.

 

[BigdaddyQH]

I agree. Losers like Red Eye who can only make excuses for their teams losses simply does not understand what it takes to make a championship team. He has no clue. He actually thinks that finishing 16th or 17th in recruiting after going to the Championship game is a good thing. That is terrible. Terrible is the only word to describe it. Oregon has never been good enough to win it all. Now that their little system has been figured out by all, and their star QB is gone, let's see how they do. The over/under number is 10. Anyone taking the Over? What about you Red Eye?

 

[REDEYE]

O/U is actually 9 1/2...like the over as I stated in another thread...I'm not a coach or a player..so I can make excuses or come up with a reason why my team or any other team didn't win..Not one time did I discredit Ohio St..I'm just saying we were depleted by Championship game..Our recruiting keeps getting better..We are getting the kids we want..That's important..I do get why you're sore though.You just lost that 4* LB to us..By the end of the season you will be looking up at us again like you have pretty much for 10 years now...enjoy the view

 

[BigdaddyQH]

O/U is actually 9 1/2...like the over as I stated in another thread...I'm not a coach or a player..so I can make excuses or come up with a reason why my team or any other team didn't win..Not one time did I discredit Ohio St..I'm just saying we were depleted by Championship game..Our recruiting keeps getting better..We are getting the kids we want..That's important..I do get why you're sore though.You just lost that 4* LB to us..By the end of the season you will be looking up at us again like you have pretty much for 10 years now...enjoy the view

This could well be true, but it is the LAST year that Oregon will finish ahead of USC for quite some time. USC simply has superior talent lined up. If they cannot dominate a has been Oregon team starting in 2016, then it is time for Sark to go.. Oregon is not even close. Now since you mentioned it, why have you not taken Oregon over 9 1/2. It is there for the asking. Oh I forgot. You are the person who has no way of making wagers in Vegas. As you can see, I took the Over on Oregon. I have 6 more plays. I DARE you to fade any of them. Go ahead Mr. Excuse maker. Fade any one of the picks. By the way, only a chicken makes up excuses. Try being a man for once in your life. Man up to the fact that Helfrich did a terrible job preparing this team for Ohio State and their superior Head Coach.

 

[REDEYE]

I just posted I took the over 9 1/2 in the post you quoted..can't you read ? BTW , I was in Vegas for 12 days in the last month making future wagers...where were you , speaking of chicken

 

[Wanger]

He actually thinks that finishing 16th or 17th in recruiting after going to the Championship game is a good thing. That is terrible. Terrible is the only word to describe it.

16 of 22 2015 recruits had committed to Oregon in 2014 most before the 2014 season had even started, your statement about how bad finishing 16th or 17th in recruiting after going to the Championship game is nonsense.

 

[SunDodger]

With games at Arizona State, UDub, and Stanford, plus at least one game vs USC, it is going to be very difficult for Oregon to go undefeated in the Conference.

Did you just include Washington as a tough game for Oregon? Really? I guess you were not aware of the current streak in that series.


In the last 11 meetings, Oregon is 11-0 SU and 10-0-1 ATS against Washington. And the one push was when Chip Kelly took it easy on Sark. I should know because I foolishly took the +17.0.



The Huskies lose three key starters on defense. They have no proven QB, and their best offensive threat, John Ross, is out for the year.

Oregon NEVER looks past Washington. The Ducks get up for this game big time, and they always look to run it up.

I've been a Husky fan for 30+ years, and IMO, they have no shot in this game.

Tell me where I'm wrong.

 

[Addicted2quack]

We are on a very fun subject for me being a ducks fan. Big daddy is the forums most sporadic poster. I never know what direction he's going with any of his comments. Sometimes he speaks to legitimate points and facts and other times like this he lets his allegiance and emotions get in the way with his thoughts. Let me touch on the subject a bit without ruffling to many feathers.....

oregon's initial success was bought by Phil knight who obviously loves that university, but I'm sure many of the historic powerhouses in college football were bought or started with large sums of money supplied by benefactors. That's how a program becomes kick started and then they take off. Think about Texas and Oklahoma, they just so happen to have many alumni sitting on huge sums of money from the oil businesses lol. How about notre dame and the Irish populations and boosters around the country? How about Nebraska? USC is in the middle of LA and hasn't had to recruit for 40 years.... They're in a hotbed, that university recruits itself. If UCLA went on a decade long tear, then the tides would shift in LA and they would land most of the recruits.

Considering what oregon had had to work with originally and their location, they needed a kickstart. Since that kickstart, they've held their own against many of the best and most elite programs in the country. Chip Kelly was the best chance at winning a title for that program. I still think helfrich can do it, because he's a better recruiter, but kelly was an evil genius who knew schematically how to pick apart and attack defenses. Mariota leaving Hurts for sure, but not as much as everyone thinks. He won the heisman, that attracts recruits just as well as flashy uniforms and lighting up the scoreboard with an uptempo spread offense. That means the recruiting will continue to get better and as that happens the ducks will only need to shore up the defense which is the story every year. Once the defense is rebuilt, I truly believe they will play for another national title and ultimately win.

and even if they do ein a championship Oregon will never get the respect they deserve because people love to hate. It's in most everyone's mindset. Oregon is the perfect team for most fan bases to constantly rip on because they're flashy, free styling, in your face and cutting edge with their uniforms and style of play. It's the perfect recipe for old school fans to throw comments at. I can only pray to see the day Oregon wins it all and I read all the haters comments about Oregon not deserving it, or they cheated, or their uniforms weren't fair, their offense plays to fast, etc etc etc.... I literally pray for that day lololololol

 

[CFBLore]

One stat I always keep in mind when thinking/betting on teams to win the championship is that all 17 champions in the BCS and CFP era had at least one top 10 recruiting class (per rivals) on their roster. This quickly cuts the field down from 128 to 18 of teams that could win the championship. Some year someone might break through but right now that stat is 17 for 17. I'm not going against it. Top 10 classes over the last four years:

4 top 10 classes: Alabama, Auburn, Ohio St, Florida St

3 top 10 classes: USC, Florida, LSU

2 top 10 classes: Georgia, Tennessee, Texas A&M, Michigan

1 top 10 class: Clemson, Texas, Stanford, Miami, Notre Dame, UCLA, Ole Miss

 

[RunLeeRun]

and even if they do ein a championship Oregon will never get the respect they deserve because people love to hate. It's in most everyone's mindset. Oregon is the perfect team for most fan bases to constantly rip on because they're flashy, free styling, in your face and cutting edge with their uniforms and style of play. It's the perfect recipe for old school fans to throw comments at. I can only pray to see the day Oregon wins it all and I read all the haters comments about Oregon not deserving it, or they cheated, or their uniforms weren't fair, their offense plays to fast, etc etc etc.... I literally pray for that day lololololol

I'm on record as saying that Oregon's window has closed, though I can't remember really what that reasoning was. To be honest, I'd probably talk myself in and out of that argument pretty easily. Nebraska is about the closest parallel that Oregon will find in the college football landscape, most specifically the Nebraska of the 80's-90's ; isolated from talent hotbeds, ran a system that people called "a system" and would blow away most of it's opponents. But when it came to the title game, the talent gap would appear.

Now, I'm not a devout recruiting rankings extremist. The system has holes. Kids get missed. As coaches, being a great talent scout can overcome a lot. But there is still a very good foundation to be withdrawn from the rankings. At least under the prism of the BCS, it seems pretty clear it's being pretty high on the rankings if you want to be the last guy standing. Perhaps the older bowl system was more forgiving and this playoff is a shift back closer toward to that. I don't know if the early days of recruiting rankings were accurate, but looking at Nebraska's old numbers, there were a number were some highs and lows. You'd see a 28 but then they'd back that up with a 9 and under that kind of recruiting you have to trust the coaches "see" something where others didn't and that they can develop it. If that's the social experiment they want to run, they'd better be able to hang on to coaches and have continuity, that's the only way that 28 they envisioned actually turns into a top 10 class four years later.

 

[cloverleaf]

One stat I always keep in mind when thinking/betting on teams to win the championship is that all 17 champions in the BCS and CFP era had at least one top 10 recruiting class (per rivals) on their roster. This quickly cuts the field down from 128 to 18 of teams that could win the championship. Some year someone might break through but right now that stat is 17 for 17. I'm not going against it. Top 10 classes over the last four years:

4 top 10 classes: Alabama, Auburn, Ohio St, Florida St

3 top 10 classes: USC, Florida, LSU

2 top 10 classes: Georgia, Tennessee, Texas A&M, Michigan

1 top 10 class: Clemson, Texas, Stanford, Miami, Notre Dame, UCLA, Ole Miss

+ 1

 

[Addicted2quack]

I'm on record as saying that Oregon's window has closed, though I can't remember really what that reasoning was. To be honest, I'd probably talk myself in and out of that argument pretty easily. Nebraska is about the closest parallel that Oregon will find in the college football landscape, most specifically the Nebraska of the 80's-90's ; isolated from talent hotbeds, ran a system that people called "a system" and would blow away most of it's opponents. But when it came to the title game, the talent gap would appear.

Now, I'm not a devout recruiting rankings extremist. The system has holes. Kids get missed. As coaches, being a great talent scout can overcome a lot. But there is still a very good foundation to be withdrawn from the rankings. At least under the prism of the BCS, it seems pretty clear it's being pretty high on the rankings if you want to be the last guy standing. Perhaps the older bowl system was more forgiving and this playoff is a shift back closer toward to that. I don't know if the early days of recruiting rankings were accurate, but looking at Nebraska's old numbers, there were a number were some highs and lows. You'd see a 28 but then they'd back that up with a 9 and under that kind of recruiting you have to trust the coaches "see" something where others didn't and that they can develop it. If that's the social experiment they want to run, they'd better be able to hang on to coaches and have continuity, that's the only way that 28 they envisioned actually turns into a top 10 class four years later.

Thats some solid input....very well said... Let's hope for my sake and sanity you're wrong about the window closing lol

 

[Conan]

It became very clear to me when a couple of freshmen dropped balls that could have/should have been caught early on. By the 4th quarter, 4 passes were dropped by the new guys that didn't show the guts it takes to bring it home. So much for injuries. The dropped balls changed the flow of the game and that put an end to Oregon's chances to keep control over tOSU. The rest is history. Urban Meyer should get the lions share of credit.