Labron the chocker

[gtc08]

talent comparison lebron>jordan i still go with that.

just because there has never been an athlete like lebron before and he's on pace to smash every record.

some people say marino was the best QB ever, even though he didn't win anything.

are people stupid enouugh to deny rare talent just because they were unable to win a shitload of championships?

 

[HighFlyinKilla]

Skill comparison, Jordan>Lebron. Basketball talent Jordan>Lebron.

 

[gtc08]

disagree, lebron>jordan.

better athlete, better passer, more explosive, better rebounder, defensive wise they are about equal.

all jordan and kobe have on lebron is a better jumper and championships.

while championships are important, they are not an indicator of how talented a player is.

you will never see a physical specimen like lebron unless they can come up with a 7 footer who can run at 4.4-4.5 speed, while kobe and jordan are no doubt great, they are not physically gifted like lebron.

 

[Boxslayer]

talent comparison lebron>jordan i still go with that.

just because there has never been an athlete like lebron before and he's on pace to smash every record.

some people say marino was the best QB ever, even though he didn't win anything.

are people stupid enouugh to deny rare talent just because they were unable to win a shitload of championships?

You can't compare football to basketball. Basketball there are only 5 players on the court. Football there are 11 on offense and 11 on defense. Too many other players can impact the game. But QBS are the ones judged by championships more than any other position in football because they touch the ball every play. Still...

Give me a Jordan, a Kobe, a Lebron, a Wade, and I'm in the playoff hunt every single year. In football, if you have 1 good player, there are no guarantees.

I'm a big Marino fan, but you play sports to win - not accumulate statistics. The burden of winning championships is less on Marino than a basketball player though because basketball only has 5 guys on the court.

A perfect example is if me and you go play ping pong right now. I win 4 games to zero. And you say, "Yeah but I had more spikes, and I had more aces on serves."

Who cares? You lost 4 games to zero. I don't care about your stats.

You may say, "Yeah but look at the speed that I hit the ball with. And my hand strength is off the charts. My reflexes are second to none, and the downward angle that I spike balls is outstanding. I am very talented."

So what? You just lost 4 games to zero.

You play sports to WIN, and basketball moreso than any other sport, players are defined by their ability to win championships because there are so few other players on the court.

There is no doubt Lebron has a great skillset, and arguably has more talent than Jordan. But that doesn't make him a better player, or even put him in the same zip code. Cecil Collins was a talented running back out of LSU drafted by Jimmy Johnson. But he's one of the worst players in NFL history.

Lebron also doesn't have a natural shooting touch right now. He's more of a battering ram than a pure scorer from anywhere on the floor the way MJ was. Lebron can make shots around the floor, but it isn't consistent at all, and evidenced by last night, he can flat out go ice cold from 15+ feet out. But you left that out of your comparison of MJ vs. Lebron - which shooting wise easily goes to MJ. Lebron's game is 100% based on the fact that he can get to the rim at will. What's going to happen to his game when he, just like everyone, starts to get a little older, doesn't have the same explosiveness, and has to start becoming more of a shooter? MJ kept winning championships as he got older and developed into a shooter with that fade away shot. Kobe has learned to do it. Will Lebron? His shooting is rougher than MJ and Kobe.

You judge talent and identify talent to determine if they will be able to WIN. Talent does not do us any good if it doesn't get us WINS. That's why slam dunk master James White and his amazing vertical leap and talent to dunk balls is a bench warmer in the NBA. Lebron is well on his way to winning, winning championships, etc. But comparisons to Jordan are so far beyond premature.

Again, just because a guy has talent and a rare skillset doesn't make him anywhere close to being the greatest ever. I know you aren't quite saying that just yet....but we all know where this is going.

 

[knucklecup]

You give Lebron a Scottie Pippen instead of dime-a-dozen players like Boobie Gibson and Delonte West and there really shouldn't even be an argument as to who the better player is.

Lebron > Jordan

 

[HighFlyinKilla]

You give Lebron a Scottie Pippen instead of dime-a-dozen players like Boobie Gibson and Delonte West and there really shouldn't even be an argument as to who the better player is.

Lebron > Jordan

Jordan is the greatest player ever. He routinely took over games in the 4th qtr and willed his to to victory.

 

[HighFlyinKilla]

This is how the greatest player ever reponds in the clutch.

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[yanni_gogolak]

His supportng cast does'nt have anything to do with him being a clutch player. At 24 it was only MJs 3rd year in the league and was avging 37 pts, 3 stls, 1.5 blks a game and was a very clutch player. MJ was better at 24 in his 3rd year than LeBrons 24 with 6 years experiance. LeBron is no where near the player MJ was with 6 years experiance.

LOL, yea, ok. Why is Lebron always compared to Oscar Robertson for people who actually understand basketball? because MJ and Lebron are not the same player. Lebron is the only player to match Robertson in season averages. MJ never matched that.

You are in two threads talking about how Lebron missed his 4th qtr free throws. There are four other players on the court who stood around the whole 4th qtr. The reason a player like Kobe is so good is b/c he has a coach who understands how to utilize him. Mike Brown just gives Lebron the ball and everybody watches him dribble around.

btw, 6 FT's = 6 points, ORL margin of victory = 10 pts. enough said.

 

[HighFlyinKilla]

LOL, yea, ok. Why is Lebron always compared to Oscar Robertson for people who actually understand basketball? because MJ and Lebron are not the same player. Lebron is the only player to match Robertson in season averages. MJ never matched that.

Do you even bother checking the stats. Lebron avgs .8 more rebs and 1.3 more assists for his carreer and MJ avg. 3.6 more points. So to say Jordan has never done that is just crazy. Obviously you dont even bother to make sure what your posting is even true.

 

[yanni_gogolak]

Do you even bother checking the stats. Lebron avgs .8 more rebs and 1.3 more assists for his carreer and MJ avg. 3.6 more points. So to say Jordan has never done that is just crazy. Obviously you dont even bother to make sure what your posting is even true.

Why are you comparing their careers now? Lebron is just getting started.

He joined Oscar Robertson as the only players in NBA history to average 27 points, 6 rebounds and 6 assists for three consecutive years.

Lebron has also averaged at least 28, 7, & 7 the past two year, another feat MJ reached only once.

 

[HighFlyinKilla]

Why are you comparing their careers now? Lebron is just getting started.

He joined Oscar Robertson as the only players in NBA history to average 27 points, 6 rebounds and 6 assists for three consecutive years.


Lebron has also averaged at least 28, 7, & 7 the past two year, another feat MJ reached only once.

Jordan avgd. 30+ pts 6+ rebs and 5.5+ asts for 6 consecutive years. Which is far superior to 3 straight years. A half an assist doesnt count for that much.

When Lebron has a 4 year stretch like this maybe you'll have an arguement.

87-88 CHI FG% .535 RBS 5.50 AST 5.9 STL 3.16 PPG 35.0
88-89 CHI FG% .538 RBS 8.00 AST 8.0 STL 2.89 PPG 32.5
89-90 CHI FG% .526 RBS 6.90 AST 6.3 STL 2.77 PPG 33.6
90-91 CHI FG% .539 RBS 6.00 AST 5.5 STL 2.72 PPG 31.5

 

[AlwayzRight]

Jordan avgd. 30+ pts 6+ rebs and 5.5+ asts for 6 consecutive years. Which is far superior to 3 straight years. A half an assist doesnt count for that much.

When Lebron has a 4 year stretch like this maybe you'll have an arguement.

87-88 CHI FG% .535 RBS 5.50 AST 5.9 STL 3.16 PPG 35.0
88-89 CHI FG% .538 RBS 8.00 AST 8.0 STL 2.89 PPG 32.5
89-90 CHI FG% .526 RBS 6.90 AST 6.3 STL 2.77 PPG 33.6
90-91 CHI FG% .539 RBS 6.00 AST 5.5 STL 2.72 PPG 31.5

Different era...Jordans the best I agree BUT with rule changes invloving zone defense and hand checking it skewed those stats.....

 

[HighFlyinKilla]

Different era...Jordans the best I agree BUT with rule changes invloving zone defense and hand checking it skewed those stats.....

Do you understand what your saying? It was harder to score back then. Todays players numbers are skewed because its easier to score now. Which makes MJs numbers even more impressive. I can't imagine what Michael would have gotten with the hand-check rules the way they're calling it now.

 

[yanni_gogolak]

Jordan avgd. 30+ pts 6+ rebs and 5.5+ asts for 6 consecutive years. Which is far superior to 3 straight years. A half an assist doesnt count for that much.

When Lebron has a 4 year stretch like this maybe you'll have an arguement.

87-88 CHI FG% .535 RBS 5.50 AST 5.9 STL 3.16 PPG 35.0
88-89 CHI FG% .538 RBS 8.00 AST 8.0 STL 2.89 PPG 32.5
89-90 CHI FG% .526 RBS 6.90 AST 6.3 STL 2.77 PPG 33.6
90-91 CHI FG% .539 RBS 6.00 AST 5.5 STL 2.72 PPG 31.5

Dont ever count on Lebron averaging that many points. The Cavs are a defensive team, scoring is not their main concern. Surprisingly that would also relate to assists, but he still gets 7 assists a game.

Also, Lebron only averaged 37.7 minutes per game this year. When Jordan was putting up those numbers he was at 40 mpg.

 

[Boxslayer]

stats are for losers, you dont play sports to accumluate stats, you play sports to WIN

 

[HighFlyinKilla]

stats are for losers, you dont play sports to accumluate stats, you play sports to WIN

Exactly, and Jordan trumps him in both categories. Yet the Lebron supporters are always bring up stats. Its like they don't even do any research. Jordans numbers are untouchable. They think that half an assist make him the greatest ever.

 

[yanni_gogolak]

stats are for losers, you dont play sports to accumluate stats, you play sports to WIN

I totally agree, but in a team sport like basketball its a lot harder to judge two players straight up. One single player cannot win a championship, all of the other areas have to be in alignment, from the gm, head coach, assistants, etc... Jordan had all of those with the Bulls, which is why he was so successful.

 

[Boxslayer]

I totally agree, but in a team sport like basketball its a lot harder to judge two players straight up. One single player cannot win a championship, all of the other areas have to be in alignment, from the gm, head coach, assistants, etc... Jordan had all of those with the Bulls, which is why he was so successful.

If Jordan misses a handful of shots, he doesn't have 6 or 7 titles whatever he got. GM, Head coach, etc bottom line is Jordan came clutch time and time again when the game was on the line.

Basketball is the easiest sport to win solo. It's not anywhere as near of a team sport as football or baseball. Only 5 guys on the floor at once. Give me a Jordan, a Kobe, or a Lebron, etc and I will usually make the playoffs every year. Can't say the same with any other sport. Basketball players are judged on individual greatness more than any other sport.

Regular season stats mean nothing. All that matters is what happens come post season time and if you can DOMINATE YOUR SPORT AND GET TO THE TOP OF THE MOUNTAIN.

Lebron is well on his way to competing for a title most years. But if he falls short of 3 titles at least, he'll never be mentioned in the same breath as MJ.

And here we are.....Cavs lead the regular season in winning percentage, best record in the NBA, best home record in NBA, sweep through the first few rounds, it's time for Lebron to get it done and define his legacy. He's got plenty of time, but everyone is rooting for him to start now.

 

[IvanS]

Jordan and Kobe have more on Lebron than just a jumper and championships. Jordan/Kobe's fundamentals, footwork, bball IQ are all better than Lebron. Plus, Lebron is not the closer like Jordan/Kobe. I can't believe all the people saying Lebron is better than Jordan! Wow! Bunch of biased haters...

Jordan>Kobe>Lebron

(and i hate Jordan, he beat all my teams, lol)

 

[bjh21]

Thick headed individuals

There is nothing that can be posted in this topic to change anyone's opinion on the subject. The people that believe Kobe is better, and MJ is the best will never think that LB will be on that level.

I just think that LeBron is the most physically imposing player that will probably ever play the game. The combination of speed, agility, and strength will probably never be seen again. People talk about statistics and rings, but I disagree on the subject that a person that solely win their team a championship.

LeBron is the closest to ever doing that when he took the Cavs to the finals all by himself, and he is trying to do that this year as well. Yes Kobe already has three rings, but he did it as the 2nd option when Shaq was the main man in LA.

If I recall correctly once Shaq left Kobe could not get out of the 1st round of the playoffs, and was demanding a trade out of LA. So anyone that says well LeBron has no excuse just go win a title really has no clue. Cleveland has really struggled putting pieces around LB besides Mo Williams. I do not believe that LeBron will win a title without another legitimate wingman or low post scorer. There is noone that can handle that much of a game.

And now that Kobe has a shot at getting another ring you look and he has an All-Star center, Lamar who is an amazingly skilled big man, Trevor Ariza who is a very underrated defender and scorer, and some skilled point guards who fill the role.

It's just a completely subjective topic where people's minds are made up. As you can tell I am in the LB crowd, but I agree that all three are amazing.

Oh and by the way, to the person who cannot spell words correctly or make complete sentences, it does make you look any better by screaming through words about how worthless of a poster I am. I would venture to guess that I had more basketball knowledge at the age of ten that you would ever dream of having. However, by all means reply to this by saying about how I do not know anything about the game.

Also, the black mamba is going to let his team lay another egg tonight and that is why I am on Denver (-1.5) 1st Q and Denver (-4.5) for the game.