GM to Offer Two Choices: Bankruptcy or More Aid

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Who didn't see this coming. Let them go into bankruptcy. You can't keep throwing good money after bad. The union doesn't want to offer concessions, then let them go into bankruptcy.



By JOHN D. STOLL and SHARON TERLEP

General Motors Corp., nearing a federally imposed deadline to present a restructuring plan, will offer the government two costly alternatives: commit billions more in bailout money to fund the company's operations, or provide financial backing as part of a bankruptcy filing, said people familiar with GM's thinking.
The competing choices, which highlight GM's rapidly deteriorating operations, present a dilemma for Congress and the Obama administration. If they refuse to provide additional aid to GM on top of the $13.4 billion already committed they risk seeing an industrial icon fall into bankruptcy.
Some experts and members of Congress say bankruptcy reorganization is the surest way for GM to cut costs and become viable. But it could be a politically unpalatable development during a recession that already has thrown millions of workers out of jobs.

Treasury Department officials believe GM needs at least $5 billion more in U.S. loans to keep operating beyond the first quarter, said people familiar with the situation.
The call for additional funds will be a key part of the revitalization plan GM is required to file with the Treasury by Tuesday, though it is unclear whether GM will furnish a dollar amount, said people familiar with the matter. The plan is supposed to describe how the company will become self-sustaining and better compete with foreign rivals.
But it's increasingly unlikely GM will have a finished plan in time. Negotiations with GM's unions and bondholders haven't yet produced commitments to concrete concessions as required by terms of the federal loans; talks are expected to continue over the holiday weekend. People involved in the talks say progress has been slowed by the fact the Obama administration has yet to appoint a "car czar," as envisioned by the bailout program.
GM will argue it needs the additional government funds to stay out of bankruptcy court, people familiar with the matter said. At the same time, the company -- which previously had dismissed suggestions that it might need to file for bankruptcy -- has moved closer to such a prospect.
GM believes government funds would be needed for debtor-in-possession financing should the company seek bankruptcy because such money wouldn't be available from private sources, said people familiar with the situation.

The auto maker eventually may seek permission to extend the March 31 deadline to complete certain restructuring actions by at least several months.
Rick Wagoner, GM's chairman and chief executive, once fiercely opposed a bankruptcy filing, saying it would scare off customers. But his opinion has softened, and he has been influential in shaping the plan for a possible filing, said people involved in the strategy.
GM declined to comment.
GM's board began more seriously considering bankruptcy in November as the company's liquidity headed toward unsustainable levels. In early December, at the board's prompting, Mr. Wagoner hired bankruptcy lawyers and advisers to begin preparing a contingency plan, said people familiar with the matter.
In the months that followed, these bankruptcy experts worked alongside advisers Evercore Partners and Morgan Stanley, both of which previously worked for GM, to develop multiple options for GM's future.
One plan includes a Chapter 11 filing that would assemble all of GM's viable assets, including some U.S. brands and international operations, into a new company. The undesirable assets would be liquidated or sold under protection of a bankruptcy court. Contracts with bondholders, unions, dealers and suppliers would also be reworked.
GM received a tax break of around $3 billion as part of President Obama's economic stimulus plan. The break saves GM from having to pay taxes associated with its bailout.
Chrysler LLC is also due to file a viability plan Tuesday. The company is expected to submit two scenarios, one spelling out how it can restructure as an independent company and the other taking into account its tentative alliance with Fiat SpA, people familiar with the matter said.
Chrysler was given $4 billion in U.S. loans after nearly running out of money. The company is looking to Fiat to provide technology for small and midsize cars that Chrysler would build and sell under its own brands. In exchange, the Italian company would take a 35% Chrysler stake.

Other stakes in Chrysler could be parceled out to compensate the UAW and debt holders for cost concessions, leaving majority owner Cerberus Capital Management LP with a dramatically diminished holding, people familiar with the matter said. Cerberus now owns 80.1% of Chrysler, and Daimler AG 19.9%.
But like GM, Chrysler also needs more government help to stay afloat. The company has said it intends to ask for $3 billion in additional loans.
For the past few weeks, Chrysler has been urging dealers to order more vehicles to give the company enough revenue to keep going through the end of March. On Friday, executives said in a conference call that it reached its goal of bringing in 78,000 orders for February, said a dealer who participated in the call.
Chrysler declined to comment on its revamping plan.
GM's viability plan will present a restructuring strategy allowing it to be profitable in each of the regions in which it operates globally, people who have seen the plan said. The plan will include broad restructuring targets, including more than 10 plant closures in North America.
While GM's plan will include updates on talks with unions and bondholders related to concessions, the auto maker is expected to ask for leeway on when it can provide specific details about what cuts the two parties are willing to make.
Negotiations with the United Auto Workers union and a bondholders committee have been slow for several reasons. For one, both expressed frustration over the amount of sacrifice they are being asked to take, compared to other stakeholders such as dealers and even asbestos litigants. And both argued that a car czar is needed to help expedite the talks.
UAW President Ron Gettelfinger has been asking the Obama administration for more time to negotiate with the auto makers. Mr. Gettelfinger, a strong supporter of Mr. Obama's presidential campaign, is also hopeful that the government will take responsibility for some of GM's $47 billion in retiree health care obligations, said people familiar with his thinking.
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D., Calif.) and House Financial Services Chairman Barney Frank (D., Mass.) on Friday sent a letter to the chief executives of GM and Chrysler laying out expectations for their viability plans.
The lawmakers asked that the plans demonstrate "a commitment that the sacrifices necessary to turn the industry around will be shared equitably by all stakeholders" and "a demonstrated commitment to restructure your company's debt in a manner that protects the interests of the taxpayers."
<CITE class=tagline>—Deborah Solomon and Jeff McCracken contributed to this article.</CITE>
 

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They need to file a BK and reorganize... The Auto industry isnt going anywhere for awhile... What killed General Motors was the Huge spike in gas prices over the last summer combined with the current recession... They didnt save and didnt invest in the proper hybrid technology..
 

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They need to file a BK and reorganize... The Auto industry isnt going anywhere for awhile... What killed General Motors was the Huge spike in gas prices over the last summer combined with the current recession... They didnt save and didnt invest in the proper hybrid technology..
What killed the American auto industry was the UAW. This has been coming for a long time.
 

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Keep posting tocco05. Good stuff. I voted for the empty suit in the primary but did not for president as he exposed himself during the pres. campaign that he was full of shit.

The U.S. economy is on the edge of a cliff and the empty suit is edging us closer to the abyss.
 

Rx .Junior
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Keep posting tocco05. Good stuff. I voted for the empty suit in the primary but did not for president as he exposed himself during the pres. campaign that he was full of shit.

The U.S. economy is on the edge of a cliff and the empty suit is edging us closer to the abyss.

yeah right.

I dont understand why the narrow mind has to blame 1 source. Putting all the blame on the Union is asinine.. Maybe you could put some of the blame on Managements inability to be efficient like their Japanese counterparts even with their plants in the US.. So you are saying that Sales being down 40-50% from SPLY is the unions fault.. Come on Tocco.. you gotta come with something stronger than that..
 

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UAW President Ron Gettelfinger has been asking the Obama administration for more time to negotiate with the auto makers. Mr. Gettelfinger, a strong supporter of Mr. Obama's presidential campaign, is also hopeful that the government will take responsibility for some of GM's $47 billion in retiree health care obligations, said people familiar with his thinking.

Fuck this cocksucker Gettelfinger. This country has no money and this cocksucker wants the govt. to take on the responsibilty for retirees healthcare?
 

Rx .Junior
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UAW President Ron Gettelfinger has been asking the Obama administration for more time to negotiate with the auto makers. Mr. Gettelfinger, a strong supporter of Mr. Obama's presidential campaign, is also hopeful that the government will take responsibility for some of GM's $47 billion in retiree health care obligations, said people familiar with his thinking.

Fuck this cocksucker Gettelfinger. This country has no money and this cocksucker wants the govt. to take on the responsibilty for retirees healthcare?

Its a recession.. no one is buying cars.. no credit.. stagnant economy..
 

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yeah right.

I dont understand why the narrow mind has to blame 1 source. Putting all the blame on the Union is asinine.. Maybe you could put some of the blame on Managements inability to be efficient like their Japanese counterparts even with their plants in the US..
Japanese auto companies in the US don't have the UAW, maybe that has something to do with the Japanese being efficient. Are you really this fucking stupid? The UAW was the downfall of the American auto industry. End of story.
 

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Its a recession.. no one is buying cars.. no credit.. stagnant economy..
So what. Recessions happen all the time. Fuck Gettelfinger. Him and the UAW ruined these American car companies. And this cocksucker wants the govt. to take some responsibility on retirees health care? Fuck him.
 

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I saw an ad, a GM dealer was offering lifetime warranty on cars...

Didn't read the fine print, lifetime of the Car or lifetime of GM.

Let'em go under, cheaper more efficient makers will buy up some of it.
 

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I saw an ad, a GM dealer was offering lifetime warranty on cars...

Didn't read the fine print, lifetime of the Car or lifetime of GM.

Let'em go under, cheaper more efficient makers will buy up some of it.
(<)<
 

Life's a bitch, then you die!
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Everyone (well apparently no everyone) including GM knew the 13.4 billion was a bandage a best. Another waist of tax payer money. So now it’s give me more or I’ll go into bankruptcy. Good, go into bankruptcy, reorganize and maybe you’ll come back and be profitable again.
 

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Everyone (well apparently no everyone) including GM knew the 13.4 billion was a bandage a best. Another waist of tax payer money. So now it’s give me more or I’ll go into bankruptcy. Good, go into bankruptcy, reorganize and maybe you’ll come back and be profitable again.

Like a bad gambler...if I can just hit this Parlay...I'll win it all back
 

the bear is back biatches!! printing cancel....
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AP source: UAW walks away from GM concession talks
Person briefed on UAW-GM concession talks says union walks away over retiree health care

* Tom Krisher, AP Auto Writer
* Saturday February 14, 2009, 3:41 pm EST

* Yahoo! Buzz
* Print

Related:

* General Motors Corporation
* , Toyota Motor Corp.

DETROIT (AP) -- Negotiators for the United Auto Workers walked out of concession talks with General Motors Corp. Friday night in a dispute over payments to a union-administered retiree health care fund, a person briefed on the talks said Saturday.

The breakdown comes at a critical time as GM races against a Tuesday deadline to submit a plan to the government showing how it can become viable.

The Detroit-based auto giant is living on $9.4 billion in government loans, and the Treasury Department must approve its viability plan for GM to get $4 billion more. Chrysler LLC, which has received $4 billion in government loans and wants an additional $3 billion, faces the same deadline.

At GM, UAW negotiators walked away because the company made demands that were "detrimental to retirees and the ability to provide health care," according to the person, who asked not to be identified because the talks are private.

GM spokesman Tony Sapienza would say only that GM is working on its viability plan.

"We're committing to meeting the goal of providing a plan as required by terms of the restructuring plan," he said Saturday.

A spokesman for the UAW did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

Under terms of the loans to GM and Chrysler laid down by the Bush Administration, both companies must gain concessions from unions and debtholders. Among targets for concessions is GM's cash contribution to a trust fund that will take over the obligation for retiree health care starting next year.

GM says it owes $20.4 billion to the fund, and the loan terms set a target of giving the union half of the value in cash and half in GM stock. The trust fund would take over health care payments for GM's roughly 500,000 blue-collar retirees and spouses starting Jan. 1, 2010.

The trust, called a voluntary employees beneficiary association, would let GM move about $46.7 billion in retiree health care costs off its books, making it more cost-competitive with Asian automakers. It is the key feature of a new four-year contract signed in 2007 with the UAW.

The union has said that if fully funded, the trust would provide health care to retirees for 80 years.

GM also must reduce its public unsecured debt by two-thirds and has been negotiating with bondholders to swap the debt for equity. The company said in a Jan. 15 presentation to analysts that it has $41.6 billion in debt.

GM, Chrysler and their unions must also agree to reduce the companies' labor costs so they are competitive with Japanese automakers that have plants in the U.S.

GM has said its total per-employee labor costs, including wages, pensions, benefits and retiree costs, are now $69 per hour. Toyota Motor Corp., GM's biggest competitor, says its hourly costs are $53. GM's costs will drop to $62 once the retiree health care trust takes effect, the company has said.
 

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Japanese auto companies in the US don't have the UAW, maybe that has something to do with the Japanese being efficient. Are you really this fucking stupid? The UAW was the downfall of the American auto industry. End of story.

The Japanese auto companies also get tax cuts and breaks to build plants here that the U.S companies don't. The Japanese government also subsidies it's cars with the yen being low adding 56 billion dollars to our trade deficit with them.
If you look you will see that their is not much difference between the pay between the hourly but yet the Japanese managment pay is alot less then the american managment pay.

The UAW has made concession with the two tier wage system yet that is not being reported just like the fact that G.M was to put 20 billion into the healthcare account that the union was going to take over next year but now they are only going to put 10 billion in there and screw the union out of 10 billion.
 

the bear is back biatches!! printing cancel....
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the japanese are fucked too (granted no bankruptcy threat looming)

yen been strongest currency since shit hit the fan due to the yen carry trade that many hedge funds and other shit piled into over the past 5 years or so when japan had a 0% interest rate and guys like aussie had 8% interest rates

many japanese auto seeing their first losses in ? (alot of years) years

nissan said they are cutting 20k jobs globally

auto market as a whole just has too much overcapacity some will have to go under and production capacity of the industry overall has to shrink
 

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The Japanese auto companies also get tax cuts and breaks to build plants here that the U.S companies don't. The Japanese government also subsidies it's cars with the yen being low adding 56 billion dollars to our trade deficit with them.
If you look you will see that their is not much difference between the pay between the hourly but yet the Japanese managment pay is alot less then the american managment pay.

The UAW has made concession with the two tier wage system yet that is not being reported just like the fact that G.M was to put 20 billion into the healthcare account that the union was going to take over next year but now they are only going to put 10 billion in there and screw the union out of 10 billion.
Bullshit. I know a few guys that work at Ford one of them is laid off, and is still collecting 95% of his pay. He says fuck it, he wants to stay on layoff, fuck going back to work. The UAW has destroyed the American car companies.
 

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What killed the American auto industry was the UAW. This has been coming for a long time.

I disagree. It was the idiots at the top that wanted to keep building SUV's that only get 10 mpg when gas was going up. The days when the union got paid to sit around have been gone for awhile now.
 

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Bullshit. I know a few guys that work at Ford one of them is laid off, and is still collecting 95% of his pay. He says fuck it, he wants to stay on layoff, fuck going back to work. The UAW has destroyed the American car companies.

How long will that last since i've been told that went out with the contract in 2007?
 

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I disagree. It was the idiots at the top that wanted to keep building SUV's that only get 10 mpg when gas was going up. The days when the union got paid to sit around have been gone for awhile now.
Bullshit. Those days are still happening.
 

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