Donkey Test Question #3...

Cracker · Nov 14, 2008

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ther; mso-font-pitch:auto; mso-font-signature:0 0 0 0 0 0;} /* Style Definitions */ p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {mso-style-parent:""; margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";} @page Section1 {size:8.5in 11.0in; margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in; mso-header-margin:.5in; mso-footer-margin:.5in; mso-paper-source:0;} div.Section1 {page:Section1;} --> </style>25/50 NL. 9 Handed. You're on the button with:

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ontGrowAutofit/> </w:Compatibility> <w:BrowserLevel>MicrosoftInternetExplorer4</w:BrowserLevel> </w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--><style> <!-- /* Font Definitions */ @font-face {font-family:sans; panose-1:0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0; mso-font-alt:"Times New Roman"; mso-font-charset:0; mso-generic-font-family:roman; mso-font-format

ther; mso-font-pitch:auto; mso-font-signature:0 0 0 0 0 0;} /* Style Definitions */ p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {mso-style-parent:""; margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";} @page Section1 {size:8.5in 11.0in; margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in; mso-header-margin:.5in; mso-footer-margin:.5in; mso-paper-source:0;} div.Section1 {page:Section1;} --> </style>A tight aggressive player in middle position raises to $200. You choose to call on the button, and relatively tight short stack with $1,500 in the big blind pushes all-in. You've seen him do this only with big pairs and AK or AQ so far.

The middle position player thinks and folds. What should you do?

theDude24 · Nov 14, 2008

this question is way to tough to have an answer - tons of factors here.

didn't even list our stack size - what if i have 30K here - obv call.

I'm assuming we have around 1500 too?

It depends what kind of mood you are in, whether the table sucks and you can find a better spot.

in general - if you put him on a big pair, obv fold.
If on AK or AQ, it may be likely that other raises had AK, AQ, AJ and is taking away outs.

Plus the 1st guy put in 200, we put in 200, then shove for 1500

meaning we have to call 1300 to win 3200

so if think we are potentially racing it is a call.

still - way too many factors here

guy could easily be squeezing as well

i'm gonna flip a coin

my coin said call

festeringZit · Nov 14, 2008

Cracker said:
<link rel="File-List" href="file:///C:%5CDOCUME%7E1%5Czam3126%5CLOCALS%7E1%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml"><style>  </style>25/50 NL. 9 Handed. You're on the button with:


<link rel="File-List" href="file:///C:%5CDOCUME%7E1%5Czam3126%5CLOCALS%7E1%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml"><style>  </style>A tight aggressive player in middle position raises to $200. You choose to call on the button, and relatively tight short stack with $1,500 in the big blind pushes all-in. You've seen him do this only with big pairs and AK or AQ so far.

The middle position player thinks and folds. What should you do?

This is a donkey question, because there is not enough information to
make an intelligent answer. You don't even say what the stack sizes
are...

Cracker · Nov 14, 2008

Donkey Question? Don't blame me, I only posted the question from the actual quiz. I think what they are wanting is do you make the $1300 call when you only have $200 in the pot on a coin flip. The test is trying to determine a poker IQ and if you can make the correct decisions to be a profitable player. So with the odds is it profitable long term to make the call with the information you have from the hand.

I think in reality I call, but I think the answer they want is to fold.

SaltyVeteran · Nov 14, 2008

With the info here I voted fold. Not knowing the stack sizes doesn't help anything. But with the info provided, there's no reason to think he doesn't have a big pair or AK AQ. At best you're probably a flip against overs or completely dominated. And the price isn't right..

But I agree, pretty vague question..

Scoops · Nov 15, 2008

Need stack sizes,could be raise out the other guy too,fold,or call depending on necessary info.So like others said without this info you are blind so fold.

Cracker · Nov 15, 2008

Scoops said:
Need stack sizes,could be raise out the other guy too,fold,or call depending on necessary info.So like others said without this info you are blind so fold.

You can't raise, the tight aggressive middle position has already folded.

shdw01 · Nov 18, 2008

assuming we have the short stack covered, if I have to put in $1300 to win $1925 or so, I fold....only because it sounds like you are up against AK, AQ, AA, KK, QQ or JJ judging by player history.

Scoops · Nov 18, 2008

Cracker said:
You can't raise, the tight aggressive middle position has already folded.

Oh yea,I missread.My appoligies.Still, I say there isnt enough info.
If one assumes that the stacks are even then there is still alot of missing info to be able to make the correct decision.

HonestRob · Nov 18, 2008

Assuming we have BB covered this is a break even play. It costs us $1300 to win a pot of $1925. We're a 3 to 2 dog against his range of JJ+, AQ+. I'd tend to weight his range a little more toward the better hands though so I'd fold unless I'd seen him squeeze before.

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 59.891% 59.69% 00.20% 343427268 1147962.00 { JJ+, AQs+, AQo+ }
Hand 1: 40.109% 39.91% 00.20% 229610952 1147962.00 { TT }

HonestRob · Nov 18, 2008

Scoops said:
Oh yea,I missread.My appoligies.Still, I say there isnt enough info.
If one assumes that the stacks are even then there is still alot of missing info to be able to make the correct decision.

What info are you missing? This is all the info we have. This situation comes up all the time at the table with this same amount of info.

papicker · Dec 1, 2008

they have plenty of info, definitely a tough spot, i fold because i think he has jj or better a large % of the time.

farmist · Dec 13, 2008

over pair for sure

theDude24 · Dec 13, 2008

"relatively tight" and "short stack" are 2 key phrases here.... this is a perfect squeeze opportunity for him.....

ps: Honet Rob who says "This situation comes up all the time at the table with this same amount of info. "

not quite sure what tables you play at where you don't know your own stack size....

ExqusiteHoopster · Mar 10, 2010

I call with 10 10

rpark · Mar 10, 2010

shdw01 said:
assuming we have the short stack covered, if I have to put in $1300 to win $1925 or so, I fold....only because it sounds like you are up against AK, AQ, AA, KK, QQ or JJ judging by player history.

Based on his range, it is correct to fold.

TheChief+ · Mar 17, 2010

in this spot you're a coin flip at best, unless you have a lot of chips to play with whats the point? find a better spot to get your money in. it drives me nuts when people can't let a hand like 10 10 go. It's a pair of 10's for @#$% sakes, you can get outdrawn soooo easily if you're not already crushed by an over pair.

Donkwin47 · Apr 6, 2010

theDude24 said:
this question is way to tough to have an answer - tons of factors here.

didn't even list our stack size - what if i have 30K here - obv call.

I'm assuming we have around 1500 too?

It depends what kind of mood you are in, whether the table sucks and you can find a better spot.

in general - if you put him on a big pair, obv fold.
If on AK or AQ, it may be likely that other raises had AK, AQ, AJ and is taking away outs.

Plus the 1st guy put in 200, we put in 200, then shove for 1500

meaning we have to call 1300 to win 3200

so if think we are potentially racing it is a call.

still - way too many factors here

guy could easily be squeezing as well

i'm gonna flip a coin

my coin said call