Controlled dice throwing in craps?!

[RobFunk]

I saw a documentary on this the other day on the Bravo channel. This guy nicknamed "the dominator" (his first name is Dominic) goes on runs of 30 or more rolls and routinely holds dice for 30- 45 minutes like it's no big deal. He is said to be a professional craps player (I had never heard of such a thing until now.) And plays about 35-40 times a year, and teaches others how to play and even has his own book.

I had never seen anything like this. He is not doing anything illegal. He lines the dice up so it plays a mathematical advantage and throws them with a very well practiced throw (is putting it mildly, it took him quite some time and coaching to perfect this) that bounces softly off the wall to get the roll he wants. Known as "the golden touch" . He is said to be the best dice thrower on the planet.

He routinely makes 6 figures a year playing craps. Or at least he did, I don't know if he has been barred.

 

[Betallsports]

I wonder if that's the Show where the guy says, he can throw the Dice...and Hit the Same Spot on the Table, Everytime ?

 

[RobFunk]

I wonder if that's the Show where the guy says, he can throw the Dice...and Hit the Same Spot on the Table, Everytime ?

No. This was a 'breaking Vegas' docu. It told of Dom's story. He was small time obsessed with beating craps and finally did it.

 

[Presto]

This guy may be legit. I don't know. There has been some discussion on the validity of controlling dice and many arguments, naturally. The one thing that smells , much like touts; if the guy is so good, why does he have to make a living by selling his supposed winning ways?

 

[RobFunk]

This guy may be legit. I don't know. There has been some discussion on the validity of controlling dice and many arguments, naturally. The one thing that smells , much like touts; if the guy is so good, why does he have to make a living by selling his supposed winning ways?

Simple. Once everyone knows your face. The gig is up. Only way to continue your passion is write and teach others. The show I saw told how he was starting to get harassed by casino employees to disrupt his throwing.

 

[kermit16]

This guy may be legit. I don't know. There has been some discussion on the validity of controlling dice and many arguments, naturally. The one thing that smells , much like touts; if the guy is so good, why does he have to make a living by selling his supposed winning ways?

Throwing controlled dice does not go un noticed in Las Vegas Casinos or anywhere else for that matter. It's very legit tactic and just like card counting in BJ, the Casinos can and will stop you.

 

[patswin]

what the basic premise of doing this, you learn how to physically throw the dice to avoid getting a 7?

 

[celticGreen+]

Check out TheWizardOfOdds.com - he and a dice-control guy did an experiment involving this (maybe 5 years ago or so?). I would say that he is one of the more reliable authorities when it comes to gaming.

Actually, here's a link: http://wizardofodds.com/craps/appendix3.html

 

[Betallsports]

I don't know....Like Presto said, There is so many arguments about controlling the Dice and the swing of throwing it.

Only because there are a type of mathematics involved.

The Throw, where it will hit, What the Dice will hit, the Bounce, etc.....

I truly do not Believe this guy.....

 

[Betallsports]

what the basic premise of doing this, you learn how to physically throw the dice to avoid getting a 7?

I Doubt that. Again like I wrote above. You can try to Control the way you throw the Dice. But You Can't control where the Dice will Hit, or What it will hit on the Bounce.

 

[5teamparlay]

Worked dice tables over 10 years....

I was still waiting for anyone that could consistantly win and color up on a regular basis, never happenned.. no winning system, no shooter who could always beat the odds against him.

 

[Akillies]

by controlling the dice you can reduce the chances of a seven, thus putting the odds in your favor [+ev] its not easy. Most of the time the casino starts giving you heat after a couple of throws, if you seem to know what you are doing.

 

[celticGreen+]

And just to add... The results of WofO tests were pretty inconclusive. Given that card-counters and other players who find edges in gaming are routinely banned from casinos, I can't imagine this is a useful strategy. By the time you gain an edge, you wouldn't be able to play anywhere anyways.

 

[DollarDay]

Although I don't spend hundreds of hours in a casino and can't prove it, I really think that rhythmic shooting can be done. It takes hours, and I mean hours, of practice.

The idea is to stand next to the stick so you have less distance to cover for your throw. The dice are thrown - not rolled. They hit the exact same spot on the table and get the exact same bounce every time.

By throwing the dice and not rolling them you avoid a true distribution within the normal 2 - 12 pattern. Although I don't play as often as I would like I actually do the opposite when I'm at a table and look for people who roll "crazy" or with all kinds of force. Those people tend to get the true distribution and get more 7's then those who roll softly or are attempting to influence the dice. I just play the don't pass side and look for them to 7 out.

It is beyond difficult to do this, but it can be done. You have to have the exact same throw .... the same speed and height of the dice every throw. They need to land on the same spot with those other factors and you will get the same bounce.

I know of 2 people who have full blown tables regulation tables in their basement and who have done this to attempt to influence the dice. I've never been with them to a casino to see if all their practice time has worked.

Now as to the legality of it, i'm not so sure. I can't remember but I think you can legally do this in Atlantic City. I believe the only rule they can inforce in AC is that the dice "HAVE" to hit the back wall. As long as the dice hit the wall I don't think you can be escorted out of the casino.

 

[JDeuce]

I saw the documentary a while ago and have a hard time believing this guy.

There are so many tiny factors in the outcome of the roll that I think dice are next to impossible to "control." Basically, you'd have to train every muscle fiber in your arm to move the exact same way and with the same amount of strength...and the absolute slightest imperfection can throw everything off. Humans aren't mechanical machines. Hell, look at how often a pitcher misses the strike zone. Bit of a different comparison, I know. But still.

Not suggesting this guy is a scam artist, but I'd be amazed if someone really could control dice throws.

 

[bigbet1234]

The author of the book says it all.....he is a joke

 

[Betallsports]

Although I don't spend hundreds of hours in a casino and can't prove it, I really think that rhythmic shooting can be done. It takes hours, and I mean hours, of practice.

The idea is to stand next to the stick so you have less distance to cover for your throw. The dice are thrown - not rolled. They hit the exact same spot on the table and get the exact same bounce every time.

By throwing the dice and not rolling them you avoid a true distribution within the normal 2 - 12 pattern. Although I don't play as often as I would like I actually do the opposite when I'm at a table and look for people who roll "crazy" or with all kinds of force. Those people tend to get the true distribution and get more 7's then those who roll softly or are attempting to influence the dice. I just play the don't pass side and look for them to 7 out.

It is beyond difficult to do this, but it can be done. You have to have the exact same throw .... the same speed and height of the dice every throw. They need to land on the same spot with those other factors and you will get the same bounce.

I know of 2 people who have full blown tables regulation tables in their basement and who have done this to attempt to influence the dice. I've never been with them to a casino to see if all their practice time has worked.

Now as to the legality of it, i'm not so sure. I can't remember but I think you can legally do this in Atlantic City. I believe the only rule they can inforce in AC is that the dice "HAVE" to hit the back wall. As long as the dice hit the wall I don't think you can be escorted out of the casino.

Ok, Look at the Picture Below......See the little Egg cartons foam along the wall......This is what will Stop you from having the same Bounce on Every roll or Throw.

 

[Betallsports]

Now add the Chips that are Stacked on the Table...Plus the Bets ( more chips )

You Just can't get the same Bounce or Hit the same Spot on Every Throw.

 

[DollarDay]

BAS - the idea is for the dice to land where the back wall hits the floor part and limit the amount of bounce the dice have.

 

[FZA]

i saw this also, really is amazing how good he got