Bush's buddy: Abu Mazen .... nice guy!

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ahmoud Abbas, known by his nom de guerre Abu Mazen, has been tapped by PLO leader Yasser Arafat to be the prime minister of the Palestinian Authority .... Beyond his senior position in the PLO, however, Abu Mazen is also a Holocaust revisionist, a conspiracy theorist, and a promoter of terrorism
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In 1983, he wrote The Other Side: The Secret Relationship between Nazism and the Zionist Movement, wherein he suggested that the figure of six million Jews murdered by the Nazis was a false one, "peddled" by the Jews

Mahmoud Abbas, known as Abu Mazen, provided financing for the terrorist attack that killed 11 Israeli athletes at the 1972 Olympic Games in Munich, Germany .... Mazen who as late as March 2003 - just before his appointment - called for the killing of Jewish settlers

Mazen has attended two summits with George Bush and He's even received an invitation to the White House ...
and in fact has been praised by President Bush as "a man dedicated to peace,"

GWB ... a very "interesting" study ...
 

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What I don't get is why do they even bother with negotiating with these guys if they are indeed terrorists? Is it just me or is it really that hard to just say "hey guys, as of this date, we are pulling out. You can get assistance from us and we will help set up elections for you a few days beforehand or we can just leave the keys in the middle of Ramallah and every warlord can duke it out if you are so stupid". That would instantly solve the problems there and provide precedent for the future. If people want to follow numb-minded terrorists so be it, that is their choice. If they want true leaders who yearn for educating and building the population, not the enrollment counts of willing suicide bombers, that should be allowed to come out as well. If such an offer was truly made, my money is on the others in the middle east to come racing in and telling them to get their acts in gear. Other rulers in the region realize that a chaotic and non-productive Palestine does them no good.
 
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Wildbill:

This area of the world is very simple: Arabs vs Jews ... the rest of the story is far from simple to understand

With guys like Mazen having a piece of the action, Bush can forget about his dream in the Mideast cause will not happen ... hell, the PLO charter still advocates complete destruction of the Israeli state and Arafat had a map of the Mideast in his compound: NO ISRAEL !

Israel has gone to bat MANY, MANY times with concessions on territory ... the Arabs have always balked ... and I dont see anything changing with Arafat passing .. hell, tonite there were gunshots at a rally Mazen was attending
 

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So why not do what I just suggested? Give the problem to someone else, let them own it, then let them realize that it is far easier to sit distanced from the problem with no stake in it than to be the ones with all the stakes involved. As long as the Palestinians continue to get romanticized with a clear out in blaming Israelis for their plight, this will continue. The moment they have no one to blame but themselves is when the issues will get dealt with.

Terrorist organizations only know destruction and being the "opposition". If the people asked them to be the organizers and facilitators of society they would quickly fall on their face, or more likely just flat out turn down the job. It is time to see which happens, but once I again my money is on the rest of the area to come racing in and tell them all it is time to get serious. No economy can grow or survive solely on sacrificing its young for a holy war it has no chance of winning. Short of getting this state to take care of that romantic view, this is a battle with no ending.

While I don't trust Sharon to make all the right moves, I think he is at least onto something here. He knows it won't win votes and will piss off a lot of people, but that is exactly what serious leaders of serious states do. No one on the Palestine side has that much skin in the game yet.
 

bushman
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I don't see a way out for any of them.

I presume there will be a power struggle now that Arafat is gone.
The Palestinians won't be doing much negotiating anytime soon, meantime the Israelis will steal as much as they can.


Israel is about to sign a peace deal in the 90's.
So the Israelis shoot their own flipping leader. :>Grin>
(even the palestinians didn't do that one. nice one Israel)

Israel comes up with the wall as a solution, which is not a bad idea.
So the Israelis build it on the Palestinian side. :>Grin> (heh. fúcking hilarious)

Israel moves into east Jerusalem and builds illegal settlements in Gaza and the West bank. :>Grin> (what a great idea for peace. Kinda like a John Wayne cowboy and indian movie)

I used to take both sides seriously. Not any more.

The Palestinians and the Israelis have zero credibility.
That part of the middle east is comedy central.

Now what I would like is the leader of each side to dress up in clown-suits, red noses orange hair huge shoes etc for their next 'peace talks'.

Then I might take them more seriously.
smile.gif
 
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eek:

Educate me .. steal what? Seventy-five percent of the land in east Jerusalem, which the press calls "historically Arab east Jerusalem," has been owned by Jews since 1947

Israel's boundaries were determined by the United Nations when it adopted the partition resolution in 1947. In a series of defensive wars, Israel captured additional territory. On numerous occasions, Israel has withdrawn from these areas. As part of the 1974 disengagement agreement, Israel returned territories captured in the 1967 and 1973 wars to Syria. Under the terms of the 1979, Israeli-Egyptian peace treaty, Israel withdrew from the Sinai peninsula for the third time. It had already withdrawn from large parts of the desert area it captured in its War of Independence. After capturing the entire Sinai in the 1956 Suez conflict, Israel relinquished the peninsula to Egypt a year later. In September 1983, Israel withdrew from large areas of Lebanon to positions south of the Awali River. In 1985, it completed its withdrawal from Lebanon, except for a narrow security zone just north of the Israeli border. That too was abandoned, unilaterally, in 2000. After signing peace agreements with the Palestinians and a treaty with Jordan, Israel agreed to withdraw from most of the territory in the West Bank captured from Jordan in 1967. A small area was returned to Jordan and the rest was ceded to the Palestinian Authority. The agreement with the Palestinians also involved Israel's withdrawal, in 1994, from most of the Gaza Strip, which had been captured from Egypt in 1973.

Realities on this conflict:

One:
The Palestinians are the aggressors; they started the conflict, and they purposely drive it forward with fresh killing on an almost-daily basis.


Two: The Palestinians regard this second intifada not as a sporadically violent protest movement, but as a war, with the clear strategic aim of forcing a scared and emotionally exhausted Israel to surrender on terms that would threaten Israel's viability.

Three: As a tactic in this strategy, the Palestinians will not fight Israeli forces directly but instead have concentrated their efforts on murdering Israeli civilians. The greater the number, the more pathetically vulnerable the victims--disco-goers, women and children in a pizza restaurant--the better. Four: Israel has acted defensively in this conflict; and while Israeli forces accidentally killed Palestinian civilians, their planned lethal attacks have all been aimed only at Palestinian military and terror-group leaders.
 

bushman
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Israel Sharon waves to the crowds
after the latest UN peace talks.


clown.GIF


A UN resolution was passed today that all Israelie and Palestinian
delegations have to drive around in multicoloured clown cars that
go "parp parp" as they drive along.


Sorry Doc.
I really cant take either side seriously
-where peace is concerned.
 

bushman
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Democratic restrictions imposed on Palestinians in East Jerusalem.
(because the Israelis have nicked it.)

The clownshow rocks on.
smile.gif


-----------------------------------------------------

Early troubles for Palestinian voter registration



This month the Palestinians began a registration drive to prepare for municipal, presidential and parliamentary elections.

An Israeli military closure order is posted to the door of an empty office in a community centre that sits astride the dusty streets of the Shufat Palestinian refugee camp in Israeli occupied East Jerusalem. The office didn't belong to a political party inciting violence, or to a militant Islamic group.

It was a centre to register voters for planned Palestinian elections, and the Israelis have shut it down along with five others in the city.

This month the Palestinian Authority started a registration drive to prepare for municipal, presidential and parliamentary elections it hopes to hold within the next six months.



It's a step towards meeting Palestinian, Israeli and international demands for democratic reforms within the PA, which is beset by charges of corruption and autocratic rule.

Israeli action has "complicated the situation technically, legally, and politically", says Palestinian Election Official Ammar Dwaik.

"We were surprised that the Israelis would take such a blatant anti-democratic move to block the elections process in Jerusalem because the Israelis understand that elections won't take place without Jerusalem."

'Israeli territory'

Around one thousand voter registration centres have been set up in the occupied West Bank and Gaza Strip. Not many Palestinians are rushing to sign up for planned municipal, presidential and parliamentary elections - they're disillusioned with their government, frustrated with Israeli military closures, and sceptical their vote will change anything.

But still the offices are functioning. So why did Israel shut down only those centers in Palestinian East Jerusalem?


Because Jerusalem is sovereign Israeli territory, says Spokesman Raanan Gissin.

"Jerusalem has a totally different status, the municipal boundaries have been determined by the 1981 law, approved by the Knesset.

"It's not occupied territory and as any other country would not permit political activity of a foreign country, particularly voting, so Israel has the same right to prevent that kind of political activity within Jerusalem itself."

International law is clear about East Jerusalem. It's occupied Palestinian territory, with the same status as the West Bank and Gaza.

"We don't accept that", says Mr Gissin,

"No one has the right to tell us what would be the status of Jerusalem, when Jerusalem has been, was and will be forever the capital of the Jewish people."

Silence

Most countries don't recognise Israel's sovereignty there, including the United States and the Europeans.

American and EU officials have indicated they don¿t support the closure of the Palestinian registration offices, but so far have not publicly reprimanded Israel.

Palestinians say Israel's action violates their democratic rights. They say it also underlines the hypocrisy of Israeli and international demands for reform.



"Disturbing the elections is disturbing the revival of the Palestinian society," says Palestinian Cabinet Secretary Hasan Abu Libdeh.

"It's a very serious disturbance to the realization of George W Bush's vision for a two state solution. It's a serious blow to all those who are advocating a renewal of the Palestinian leadership."

And the response from the international community has been disappointing, he says: "We are not necessarily into the dancing mood now concerning the kind of response and the quality of response."

Two years ago the US President George W Bush famously called on the Palestinians to elect a new and different leadership.

It was part of his vision of a Palestinian state living side by side with Israel.

The Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon says there won't be movement in the peace process without a reformed Palestinian Authority.

Palestinians have responded by beginning to organise their first national elections in seven years. But when it comes to Palestinian democracy in occupied East Jerusalem, Israel is obstructing them, and the Americans have little to say. <!-- E BO -->

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3674202.stm
 

Is that a moonbat in my sites?
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I guess what you people are saying is that Robert Byrd, a past Grand Supreme Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan, and one of the Democrat leaders of the Senate, can have a change of heart and the forgiveness that goes with it, but any one else who's not a Democrat can change his heart and mind (although I really wouldn't trust a Palestinian).


What utter hypocrasy!
 

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BBL,

What the hell does this have to do with Robert Byrd and US politics? Lets stay on topic here. Sure we could find similar problems all over the world, but what does that accomplish in discussing a Middle East problem that needs a solution?
 

Is that a moonbat in my sites?
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WildBill - I'm just using an argument that's often used on this forum - If so and so can do this, why can't my guy?

To be perfectly honest, I think Bush will be stuck with whoever ends up being top Paletinian dog - and if Bush can help in choosing the least of all of the evils to be tiop dog, then he should pragmatically do so.

I would rather unleash the Jews on Islam - I'd feel much more secure with Jewish oil than I do with Muslim oil.
 
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bblight:

wow! I agree ....

Sharons nickname is the "Bulldozer" .. back Israel and give em what they need in their fight to survive
 

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