Bet Pan Am / Sportsbook review Sportsbook review attended

wilheim · Feb 4, 2004

FWIW - I believe Buzz has hit the nail on the head.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>The PanAm owners should pay and Scotty and Marty should get out of there as soon as they get everyone paid. The PanAm owners are not honorable and should never be trusted again. That's just my opinion <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

wil.

SunDevil · Feb 4, 2004

Certainly sounds like the unfortunate case as far as the "good guys" are concerned. However, let's not absolve these "good guys" entirely because it was they who:

1) Represented these owners as having "deep pockets" and
2) Continue to vouch (on behalf of the owners)that everyone will be paid

I don't represent or vouch for anyone unless they're family or a close friend for a minimum of 3 years....and even then, I often don't. Scotty, Marty, etc. did/still do and for that they should be held accountable.

NickyDeuces · Feb 4, 2004

BetPanAm , Get to the Getting and pay these people!

Buzzsaw · Feb 4, 2004

SunDevil,
No arguement here.

All I will add, and I'm not making excuses for them, is that they were decieved by these Panamaian pirates. We all were.

But it's fair to keep an eye on them after the smoke clears. Scotty and Marty are trustworthy and hard workers that have done outstanding work in this industry in the past. But as SunDevil indicated, their stock is way down and it's up to them to fight their way back.

RobertoCastiglioni · Feb 4, 2004

I and John have quiet some history in agreeing to disagree . This is just another one of those situations . John is indeed aware of the damages left behind in Royal by one of these two guys. Hardworking is the least appropriate term in this case, as John well knows.

What is puzzling me is why people "in the know" still have to adress these issues this way .

I can understand Ken, I happen to know him quiet well and I know that he follows his heart more than his logic at times. I think its totally wrong to hold Ken responsible of this debacle.

I fail to understand John though : Managers have to run the business, not investors. If they are capable they succeed, if they aren't they fail. Investors turn their back on Managers, not customers.

Managers make business plans, execute them and act on behalf and in the interest of investors. Sometimes managers have to fight with their investors to secure the asset of the business. Yet they ( managers ) are ultimately responsible.

Snakes sell dreams , waste money, and then yell " its someone elses fault " .

Who was running Panam ? Be less gullible Gentlemen.

Roberto

Muddy · Feb 4, 2004

Roberto, how come you are not working at royal anymore?

Dante · Feb 4, 2004

Scorpion I thought you quit!!

JK man could not resist

RobertoCastiglioni · Feb 4, 2004

Scorpion,

Royal has been a great challenge that has granted me enourmous satisfactions. However, after one and half year spent managing the Company I wanted to move on to different objectives within the Group. I met the majority shareholder mid december to talk about this issue and , on my way back to Curacao, Leonardo ( my first son ) decided to be born well ahead time.

I have since then dedicated all my energies and attentions to Leonardo, whom is now scheduled to be home sometime mid March .

It would have indeed been impossible to manage Royal and grant Leonardo the attentions he currently needs.

Kevin was already "training" in those days and, thanks to my very impatient son , found himself in the "seat".

Roberto

TheGeneral+ · Feb 4, 2004

Roberto,

We wish your family the best.

HateTheRiverCard · Feb 4, 2004

Roberto,

Good to see you dropping by to post and even better to hear that the little one's due home soon. All the best to you and your family.

HTRC

Wrigley · Feb 4, 2004

This sounds just like many other books that have gone under, Best you can hope for is another book to take the accounts from them.

But the new book will require you to rollover any balance you have a certain number of times before withdrawl, but it would be better then nothing.

Hope you all get paid !

SunDevil · Feb 4, 2004

I'm sure Roberto has better things to do with his time, but could somebody else tell me who the "John" is that he refers to? I can't grab it from the context of his post and it will help his whole post come together for me if I understand "John"'s role.

Thanks!
SD

NickDouglas · Feb 4, 2004

THANK YOU, ROBERTO. *Finally* someone posts something sensible about the relationship between Scotty/Marty and PanAm's investors. Everyone should read Roberto's post before they assess or absolve blame in this case.

Halifax · Feb 4, 2004

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by SunDevil:
I'm sure Roberto has better things to do with his time, but could somebody else tell me who the "John" is that he refers to? I can't grab it from the context of his post and it will help his whole post come together for me if I understand "John"'s role.

Thanks!
SD<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

John = "Buzzsaw" = SportsBookReview

SunDevil · Feb 4, 2004

Ahhhh, that helps.

Thanx Hal.

Buzzsaw · Feb 5, 2004

Roberto,
I'm surprised you would say those things because you yourself were in quite a similar situation in July/August. And if you recall, I said the same thing about your situation because it's the truth. You were(still are) a good guy too but if your investors would not have come through with the money, well, Royal would have been history just exactly like PanAm appears to be.

Keep in mind that neither of these guys are managing directors so to blame them for lack of funding by the principals is an incredible and even a bit of a malicious reach.

dogball · Feb 5, 2004

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Snakes sell dreams , waste money, and then yell " its someone elses fault " .

Who was running Panam ? Be less gullible Gentlemen <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Does this mean that dealing with the sharps and movers was a huge mismanagement??

thanks and bol with leo

RobertoCastiglioni · Feb 5, 2004

John,

Situation in July '02 was different. The guy currently at Panam had been "active" since after superbowl undermining the relationship between Royal and its agents to his future benefit .

Others were preparing to move to reggae Island , packing the db on top of their clothes and contacting customers requesting them to pull out money, as their "deal within the deal" ( the famous 500K aside ) had been exposed . Yet the majority shareholder did come up , even with such scenario.

We will definitely have time to talk about it. Please keep the word "malicious" out of the way, you adressed the wrong person with it.

Roberto

TheGeneral+ · Feb 5, 2004

Poor management of players, money, & software is what causes books to get into financial trouble.

Sure, Scotty & Marty are Good Guys, but they were there and they were apart of the team that appears to have left us hanging out to dry. They must be held responsible in part.

The door of communication needs to re-open. Without that, there is little hope of righting the ship.

Betpanam · Feb 5, 2004

General,
The communications are still here. As I have told you on many occasions. Those that call the office get me. I have many calls everyday now. I also answer every e-mail that comes to me. Once again my e-mail is scotty@betpanam.com. Alot of times I am not in the office much anymore working from home. If you put your phone number in the e-mail I will call you back from my house. I havent left anyone out to dry. I am working as hard as I can to get everyone paid.Everyone that has called here and gotten me has been given the full story in detail as to whats going on.I make sure they at least get that. I chose not to post on the forums until I can tell people exactly what is going on. I was told one thing last week that didnt come through on time and have paid for that ever since. I am not an investor here. And I dont have access to them all the time either. I can only report what I am told and thats it. Do I still feel everyone is gonna get paid??? I do. Do I know 100% for sure. No. Have people been getting paid?? Yes. Is it as fast and timely as I would like??No. Is it a good sign that the offices are still open and no one seems to have left? Yes,I feel that they are trying to right the ship. Sorry for the lack of communication on the forums guys. If you contact me I will deal with you one on one.
Scotty