All Things, Trayvon Martin / George Zimmerman

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powdered milkman
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Released today were witness statements (www.foxnews.com) from the night of the shooting:

New witness accounts also emerged Thursday. A witness, whose name is redacted, told investigators he saw "a black male, wearing a dark colored hoodie," on top of a white or Hispanic male who was yelling for help.

The witness, who was looking out the sliding glass door at his home about 30 feet (10 meters) away, said he saw the black male throwing punches "MMA (mixed martial arts) style."

He said he told the fighters he was calling the police. He said that as he was making the call, he heard a shot. He looked outside and saw the person who had been on top laid out on the grass as if he had been shot. He said the other fighter was standing on the sidewalk, talking to another person with a flashlight.


oops just saw Enfuego posted this
 

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All that is clear is there was a confrontation and a fight. There is still no absolute evidence as to how it was started. You do not know who approached who and what was said. You do not know that Zimmerman merely walked up to Martin and asked him what he was doing. You do not know that this is what happened. Again, you are speculating as to what might have happened. You don't know so don't speculate and then say its pretty clear.

You are right, I have no idea who approached who (doesn't matter). It does not matter what was said.

What we do know for a fact is that Martin was high on Marijuana, on top of Zimmerman who was screaming for help (witness statements) and Martin had cut knuckles with Zimmerman suffering two black eyes, a broken nose and laceration to the back of his head.

Wabash, do you dispute any of those facts I've just presented?
 
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Yes, I have a question. Why does it matter if he walked up to Martin? Why does that matter?
I never said it mattered one way or another because I don't know that he walked up to Martin. You keep saying he did, but you don't know what happened. Ive heard some people say that Martin walked up to Zimmerman and attacked him. So, which is it? who walked up to who? No one knows for sure except Zimmerman. What does matter is how the confrontation started and why. And again this goes back to my original question which no one can answer. Why did Zimmerman think Martin was suspicious if he was just walking down the street? Why did Zimmerman even feel the need to get out of his "marked" car? If he was in a vehicle marked "neighborhood watch", then why not just drive up to the person so the person can see who you are and ask him what he is doing?

Let me ask 1 more question...If Zimmerman were asked right now if he was in the exact same position as he was when he very first saw Martin, do you think he would say he would still do the exact same thing as he did this time? Or do you think he would say that he would have done things differently?
 

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I never said it mattered one way or another because I don't know that he walked up to Martin. You keep saying he did, but you don't know what happened. Ive heard some people say that Martin walked up to Zimmerman and attacked him. So, which is it? who walked up to who? No one knows for sure except Zimmerman. What does matter is how the confrontation started and why. And again this goes back to my original question which no one can answer. Why did Zimmerman think Martin was suspicious if he was just walking down the street? Why did Zimmerman even feel the need to get out of his "marked" car? If he was in a vehicle marked "neighborhood watch", then why not just drive up to the person so the person can see who you are and ask him what he is doing?

Let me ask 1 more question...If Zimmerman were asked right now if he was in the exact same position as he was when he very first saw Martin, do you think he would say he would still do the exact same thing as he did this time? Or do you think he would say that he would have done things differently?

Please don't avoid the questions. One step at a time.

What we do know for a fact is that Martin was high on Marijuana, on top of Zimmerman who was screaming for help (witness statements) and Martin had cut knuckles with Zimmerman suffering two black eyes, a broken nose and laceration to the back of his head.

Do you dispute these facts?
 
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Please don't avoid the questions. One step at a time.

What we do know for a fact is that Martin was high on Marijuana, on top of Zimmerman who was screaming for help (witness statements) and Martin had cut knuckles with Zimmerman suffering two black eyes, a broken nose and laceration to the back of his head.

Do you dispute these facts?


LOL, I am avoiding questions? You still have not answered my question. I answered yours. Then you want to take it one step at a time, but you start with the fight? LOL priceless. How about starting at the beginning and answer my question for once. Why did Zimmerman feel the need to call the cops and pursue someone who was merely walking down the street? You answer that question first, then we take it one step at a time from there.
 

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LOL, I am avoiding questions? You still have not answered my question. I answered yours. Then you want to take it one step at a time, but you start with the fight? LOL priceless. How about starting at the beginning and answer my question for once. Why did Zimmerman feel the need to call the cops and pursue someone who was merely walking down the street? You answer that question first, then we take it one step at a time from there.

You need to follow very closely and read the posts before responding.

I answered your question in post #186 and told you I don't know why he thought he was suspicious. The bottom line is it doesn't matter why he thought he was suspicious. He thought he was suspicious, called 911 and followed him. End of story.

You replied and acknowledged my answer to your question in post #191. You acknowledged me saying I answered your question. I've answered your question and you've acknowledged that I've answered your question.

Now that I've answered your question twice please respond to the following...

What we do know for a fact is that Martin was high on Marijuana, on top of Zimmerman who was screaming for help (witness statements) and Martin had cut knuckles with Zimmerman suffering two black eyes, a broken nose and laceration to the back of his head.

Do you dispute these facts?
 

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Please don't avoid the questions. One step at a time.

What we do know for a fact is that Martin was high on Marijuana, on top of Zimmerman who was screaming for help (witness statements) and Martin had cut knuckles with Zimmerman suffering two black eyes, a broken nose and laceration to the back of his head.

Do you dispute these facts?

Must have been shitty weed. If T had the diez the last thing he would want to do is come to blows with some fat wanna be rent a cop.
 

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FACT: George Zimmerman lived in a neighborhood that had been hit by a rash of burglaries.
FACT: George Zimmerman volunteered as a member of his neighborhood watch program.
FACT: George Zimmerman was carrying a weapon the night Trayvon Martin was shot.
FACT: Trayvon Martin was carrying $40.15, package of Skittles, a red lighter, headphones and a photo pin when he was killed.
FACT: Trayvon Martin had THC in his system when shot.
FACT: George Zimmerman shot and killed Trayvon Martin.
FACT: The on-scene investigator recommended Zimmerman be arrested and charged with manslaughter.
FACT: A physical confrontation took place.
FACT: A photo taken at the scene showed Zimmerman had a bloody nose and a 1-inch laceration on his head and forehead abrasion.
FACT: Witness statements claim "a black male, wearing a dark colored hoodie," was on top of a white or Hispanic male who was yelling for help.
FACT: Media outlets around the U.S. showed a photo of 14-year-old Martin instead of current photos.
FACT: Media outlets around the U.S. showed a photo of a much heavier George Zimmerman than he really was.

UNKNOWN: Why George Zimmerman thought Martin looked suspicious.
UNKNOWN: Who approached who and made initial contact either verbal or physical first.
UNKNOWN: If George Zimmerman felt his life was in danger.

What am I missing?
 

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The new medical reports on the George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin case tell us a lot. And it is not just for what they find, but also what they don’t find.

First, the reports provide striking evidence that Zimmerman did not start the fight with Martin, and that Zimmerman shot Martin in self-defense. Martin’s injuries were two-fold: broken skin on his knuckles and the fatal gunshot wound.

Zimmerman’s injuries involved: a fractured nose, a pair of black eyes, two lacerations to the back of his head and a minor back injury.

It takes considerable force to break the skin on multiple knuckles. The large range of injuries on Zimmerman indicates that the Martin’s attack was prolonged. But here is what is missing: where are the injuries to Zimmerman’s hands? Where are the bruises on Martin’s face or other parts of his body? The evidence paints a picture where Martin was the only person landing blows.

The broken skin on Martin’s knuckles and Zimmerman’s wounds obviously provide some justification for self-defense. But if Zimmerman is to have justifiably used self-defense, he can’t have provoked Martin’s attack.

The affidavit filed by the prosecutor against Zimmerman was extremely weak and had many glaring omissions. It does not answer the most crucial question: Who attacked whom? All it states is: “Zimmerman confronted Martin and a struggle ensued.” “Confronted” does not mean “provoked” or “assaulted.” It may mean that Zimmerman merely followed Martin and asked him what he was doing in the neighborhood.

Surely Zimmerman had the right to investigate a strange person in his neighborhood. But, in any case, Zimmerman simply asking Martin why he was in the neighborhood doesn’t give Martin the right to start striking him or pounding his head into the concrete sidewalk.

Simple words do not justify hitting someone.

Anyway, it appears that Zimmerman didn’t even question Martin. The 911 tape of Zimmerman reporting a strange person in the area indicates that Zimmerman didn’t even try to ask Martin a question.

When the police operator told Zimmerman “we don’t need you to do that [following Martin],” Zimmerman appears to have stopped following Martin and agreed to go to where the police would be arriving.

The medical evidence implies that Zimmerman did not physically attack Martin and thus there was no justification for Martin to start hitting Zimmerman.

With the case unraveling, it makes the prosecutor’s behavior look even more outrageous. The prosecutor wasn’t required to go to the grand jury for the indictment, but the fact that she didn’t in such a high-profile case is troubling. Everyone knows how easy it is for a prosecutor to get a grand jury to indict, because only the prosecutor presents evidence and the standard of proof is very low.

A grand-jury indictment would have provided political cover; that charges were brought without one means that the prosecutor was worried that even a grand jury would not give her the indictment.

The Obama administration has been fanning the flames, and it isn’t just President Obama's attempt to personalize the tragedy.

News reports surfaced Tuesday that the U.S. Justice Department was pushing hard to charge Zimmerman, who is part black himself, with a hate crime because Martin was black. Such a charge can carry a life prison term or even the death penalty.

Yet, Zimmerman and his wife mentored two black children for free.

A recent Reuters report that interviewed Zimmerman’s neighbors found that both black and Hispanics viewed Zimmerman as someone who cared deeply about his neighbors and volunteered to head the community watch to help them.

The claim that Zimmerman referred to blacks as "f***ing coons" has long since been dropped.

Using this case for political purposes has already come at a real cost. In Gainesville, Florida; Oak Park, Illinois; Mobile, Alabama; Toledo, Ohio; Grand Rapids, Michigan; and possibly Norfolk, Va., blacks have attacked whites in what they think is revenge for Zimmerman attacking Martin because he was black, and those are just the cases where the perpetrators would make some comment such as “This is for Trayvon.”

The media has been partially responsible for this aftermath with its sensational reporting. Recent coverage has helped to balance things out, but responsible reporting requires still more.

Bottom line: the medical reports about George Zimmerman are revealing a lot more information than the media have so far let on.
John R. Lott, Jr. is a FOXNews.com contributor. He is an economist and co-author of "Debacle: Obama's War on Jobs and Growth and What We Can Do Now to Regain Our Future."
 

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Guys WW is going to play who's on first all day long. Apparently this is much more important to him than to most. Personally it is not on my calendar, it was tragic, it is a done deal, and now it goes to the court for a decision. We have nothing to do with it. I am much more concerned about the upcoming Supreme Court decisions and accelerating deficits. WW doesn't know but refuses to acknowledge that Martin may have been trying to avoid Zimmerman and was ignoring him and who knows maybe speeding up his pace. I heard Zimmerman comment that the cops take too long to get there and he was tired of letting people of concern get away. Anyone who thinks Zimmerman did not verbally try to communicate with WW is in lala land anyway. Zimmerman has been described as a pretty decent guy with no apparent prejudices. Now who's on first and 105 days till kickoff. Now we are talking.
 

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You can add wabashwonders to the fools list. Another guy who talks in circles.

I answered your question about "suspicious" sir. Quit saying that nobody answered it.

And the police dispatcher did NOT tell Zim top get back in his car or not to pursue Martin as you wabash, vit, aki, and others in this thread continue to say erroneously. They told him "we don't need you to do that". Thast is not an official order not to continue to follow Martin.

And lastly, you have no friggin idea what the neighborhood watch rules were or if there were even any such rules or if there were how legally binding they were. So quit saying that you know. You don't.

You are a waste of my energy. Good night.
 

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And when asked to verify some very basic facts about the case, Wabash disappears. Pretty standard practice here at the RX.
 

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wabitch is just another resident troll.....

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ZimmermanMartin 5.JPG
 

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Bad thread for you here. It's usually the threads you create that you take a beating in....

Are you old enough to know what Mike Tyson looked like as a fighter when he was younger? In this thread, you are one of Mike Tyson's first knockout victims. Just don't get up.
 
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Are you old enough to know what Mike Tyson looked like as a fighter when he was younger? In this thread, you are one of Mike Tyson's first knockout victims. Just don't get up.

Bingo.

The sad thing is, Vitterd will just keep lying and spinning to try to make it look like he's not getting his ass handed to him in this thread.


But, lying is like second nature when you suffer from a pathology like that. The guy seriously needs to get some help.
 

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