FINGER LAKES #1 YESTERDAY ???

themanowesme · Apr 18, 2004

Pay the guy every penny you owe this guy. If that horse finished up the track or fell down half way through the race we would never be having this discussion and you would have kept every penny that guy bet.

You got what you deserved for 2 reasons, WHY IN THE HELL WOULD YOU BOOK A SHIT TRACK LIKE FINGER LAKES. Secondly, as soon as this guy made his bets the red light should have went on if you suspected anything fishy. You fell asleep figuring that if the horse wins we will cry like little school girls or if the horse loses then oh well we got the guys money.

Your a joke for coming on here crying the blues about paying a guy after he WON. If the race was fixed it wouldnt be the first horse race that was ever fixed. I am sure you guys took bets from people who had no clue a race was fixed and they lost thier money. I will bet my last dollar that none of the losers money was refunded because some fixed horse won.

OMNIVOROUS FROG · Apr 18, 2004

Call it a day on this string Jake. No win situation, no pun intended. Got some real haters here and it can only get uglier. I am saddened that people feel you took the bets, you lose. But they are sympathetic to something really ugly. I have seen this at sportbooks here stateside. Was Bay Meadows if I remember correctly. Same guy hit all the books, but he had at least an attempt at diversion. He bet a bunch of races, buck or so, lost them all, then boom, big dimes on this longshot. It won, and everybody talked to each other, then contacted Nevada Gaming, also refused payouts. Guy slithered around, trying to collect asap. Oops, then tried a beard to collect. Fix was uncovered, all wagers were refunded and talk about banned for life...This was here, not offshore. After that they enacted max payouts. Seems like it was handled properly. Hope it all works out, as this thread is ugly. Best Wishes...OF

trytrytry · Apr 18, 2004

I want to be clear that Im very happy that you are taking the time to express your concerns about horse racing and your firms losses on this race. I do not mean to be "happy that you lost" or trying to put down your firm. you have a great business, a serivce to us bettors and I thank you for taking risks everyday and offering lines, parlays, contests etc.

so you mean you did not have any losing wagers at Finger Lakes RAce #1 to refund? only 3 clients who had the winner on that small race. OK thats fine. But you took the wagers and confirmed them by hand and that is that.

I think we realize that if you had some losing wagers at Finger Lakes you would also refund those while not paying the winners.

Did you refund the wagers from the Baffert horse that I posted above?

I have lost thousands at ehorsex and betfair exchanges on wagers that were (after thinking about them after seeing the race) were clearly made by people who knew their mount would win (or lose) but I did not. Horses that looked to be 8-1 or 10-1 based on the double payoff probables have been offered at asking prices of only 3-1 or 4-1 20 minutes before post for thousands. (And I would bet these to lose thinking I had a great overlay). Then when the horse goes off 6-1 Im thinking Im the smartest guy in the world with these overlays and the horse wins for fun. Once I had a horse that looked to be 2-1 in the wagering based on double probables and current form. Some bettors were offering him at 8-1 for tons of cash 15 minutes before post and I grabbed a ton of this thinking I had a HUGe overlay (after all buyer beware). At the start of the race getting out of the gate the jockey actually jumped off this horse and landed on his rear end. YEs I was pissed that this was "fixed" yes I posted that this was unfair at the Rx and I did send my information to the raceing office of that track. But I did not claim that ehorsex should refund my cash or take the cash from that person in the know. Should I have?

You got beat this time at your own game. Seems like the clues were easy for you to see (large deposit, betting all on a minor track in the middle of the afternoon, etc. etc.) and you could have done something about prior to race time (like void these wagers that you did not want to hold) if you were really concerned about getting beat on this horse race. you choose not to and you got clucked.

Make no mistake I feel that these connections did know that the horse was a sure thing and did not want the money in the parimutual pools (or at leat most of it). you did get pounded no question. That will hurt your profit this month. But you should pay the man.

betfair has had Finger Lakes in the past right? Or am I thinking of Great LAkes Donws? Did anyone watch for any strange betting patterns at that site before this race?

Banned4Life · Apr 18, 2004

That's right this thread has gotten ugly because a few SCAM bookies (who either fell asleep or plain got greedy) are inventing excuses in order to avoid paying a legitimate winner. And are too chicken shit to even identify which books are involved in this attempted stiffing (which doesn't bother me much because I'll never play at a book not named Pinnacle or Olympic, for reasons such as this).

When a boxing match turns out to be fixed to you refuse to pay the winners? You think it's ugly now? Stiff these bettors and it will get a LOT uglier, and you can bet on it.

RIOSHILL · Apr 18, 2004

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Banned4Life:
That's right this thread has gotten ugly because a few SCAM bookies (who either fell asleep or plain got greedy) are inventing excuses in order to avoid paying a legitimate winner. And are too chicken shit to even identify which books are involved in this attempted stiffing (which doesn't bother me much because I'll never play at a book not named Pinnacle or Olympic, for reasons such as this).

When a boxing match turns out to be fixed to you refuse to pay the winners? You think it's ugly now? Stiff these bettors and it will get a LOT uglier, and you can bet on it.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Banned 4, in your opinion, if a story surfaces on the DRF site that this race was fixed, and the trainer gets suspended for a dirty test, do you still believe the books should pay?

Pickles · Apr 18, 2004

I would hope that Jake and Supremo understand how most feel - try to keep an open mind guys.
If No drugging here will you pay or do we go into the 'no professional bets'(or whatever) clauses after that...
btw Ill take no drugging for 100$ straight up,ok?

RIOSHILL · Apr 18, 2004

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Pickles:
I would hope that Jake and Supremo understand how most feel - try to keep an open mind guys.
If No drugging here will you pay or do we go into the 'no professional bets'(or whatever) clauses after that...
btw Ill take no drugging for 100$ straight up,ok?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
If there is no dirty test, we are 10000000% paying without

Pigpen · Apr 18, 2004

So I am in the possession of a $20 win ticket on this animal. Should I hurry to the track or OTB and cash it before they announce the race was fixed? Or will my ticket cash regardless of the outcome?

RIOSHILL · Apr 18, 2004

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Pigpen:
So I am in the possession of a $20 win ticket on this animal. Should I hurry to the track or OTB and cash it before they announce the race was fixed? Or will my ticket cash regardless of the outcome?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Is that a hypothetical question?

trytrytry · Apr 18, 2004

track has paid track odds already of course.

your "ticket" would be good for 1 year.

How much of a drug does it take for a horse to be cheating? Is it as much as the Baffert horse above?

any refunds from that race a few years ago?????

RIOSHILL · Apr 18, 2004

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by trytrytry:
track has paid track odds already of course.

your "ticket" would be good for 1 year.

How much of a drug does it take for a horse to be cheating? Is it as much as the Baffert horse above?

any refunds from that race a few years ago?????<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
You raise a good point. However, the track consumed its 15%, and is not out one dollar. I am sure you can understand that places that take bets that don't go into the pools would like to know that they aren't on the losing end of a boat race.

Pigpen · Apr 18, 2004

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Rio Shill:

Is that a hypothetical question?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, and I heard some whispers in the grandstand that this animal was a good play in this race?

trytrytry · Apr 18, 2004

That is a grey area. Most of the banners I read say pay track odds up to 150-1 or whatever.

Pay track odds is pay track odds.

you dont guarentee yourself with a free 15% on a wager tonight in the NHL and yet you pay the winner even if you find out 3 months from now the goalie fixed the game to go over the total or something like that

not having a hold (the 15%) really does not change this decision to pay up or not. Yes it effects your profits for this month.

And yes it is possible that all of us players could be hurt if you wnet out of business by taking too many horse wagers or any other bet that you dont have a theoretical hold on. That the gamble we take everyday with our money in your firms and we hope your good at what you do.

RIOSHILL · Apr 18, 2004

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Pigpen:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Rio Shill:

Is that a hypothetical question?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, and I heard some whispers in the grandstand that this animal was a good play in this race?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Your question is a good one, and that is why we have had such a hard time with this situation. Bottom line, is that if nothing comes up that it was fixed, and you can bet that it won't, we have to pay. We may not like it, but in that situation we will pay these guys whether we like it or not.

trytrytry · Apr 18, 2004

Great! nothing wrong with a slight amount of double checking or waiting for a payment request.

RIOSHILL · Apr 18, 2004

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by trytrytry:
Great! nothing wrong with a slight amount of double checking or waiting for a payment request.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Nobody has even called Rio to request a dollar.

RIOSHILL · Apr 18, 2004

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by trytrytry:
Great! nothing wrong with a slight amount of double checking or waiting for a payment request.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
And at least we are promising to pay with no dirty. Many many books aren't paying these known race fixers no matter how the test turns out.

HateTheRiverCard · Apr 18, 2004

The offshore books are wrong here, regardless of whether an investigation proves wrong doing or not the race was declared official and all bets were paid at the track.

As TryTryTry stated, if you guys are going to create new rules then will you go back and research all wagers you have collected on races were improprieties occurred?

If you're going to have horse racing as part of your book then employee workers that not only understand the sport but also can limit liability and/or recognize abnormal situations. If you don't then you have no one to blame but yourselves when a situation like this occurs.

HTRC

RIOSHILL · Apr 18, 2004

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote">quote:<HR>Originally posted by HateTheRiverCard:
The offshore books are wrong here, regardless of whether an investigation proves wrong doing or not the race was declared official and all bets were paid at the track.

As TryTryTry stated, if you guys are going to create new rules then will you go back and research all wagers you have collected on races were improprieties occurred?

If you're going to have horse racing as part of your book then employee workers that not only understand the sport but also can limit liability and/or recognize abnormal situations. If you don't then you have no one to blame but yourselves when a situation like this occurs.

HTRC<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
You make some meritorious points here. However, do you really think books that do not put their bets in the pool, many do btw, should take it up the ass on fixed races. Understand that the track paid out, and still made their 15%. Totally no skin off of their asses. You can't even see any point on the sides of the offshore books that don't throw the money back into the pools?

Railbird · Apr 18, 2004

Books must pay, Bonds is on illegal steroids, but if I bet against the Giants and lose I dont get a refund. Sounds like Jake is trying to be a thief here.