WTC 7. No plane hit, but building still collapses.

eek. · Feb 21, 2005

It only took me 3.5 years to find this out...gah

The WTC 7 had the same 2 inch fireproofing system, trusses etc, and was only 47 stories high.
(see section 5.3.3 in this PDF file)

It collapsed at 5:20pm, about seven hours after it had caught fire.

The new, 52-story 7 World Trade Center was conceived immediately
after the destruction of the original 47-floor structure by the terrorist
acts of 9/11. The building was not directly hit by the two planes that
took down the larger World Trade Center towers, and there were no
known casualties due to its collapse; yet, the performance of the
original WTC 7 is significant because it appears its destruction was
due primarily to fire, started by some combination of debris falling
from WTC 1 and a fuel-distribution system needed to run the
building's generators. The resulting fire burned for about seven
hours before its collapse at 5:20 the afternoon of Sept. 11.

(emboldened by me.)

Since the 9/11 attacks on the World Trade Center, there has been increased focus in New York City on egress in emergency situations occurring in multi-story buildings as well as on the ability of emergency personnel to access fires and other crises on higher floors.
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=5 align=right border=0><TBODY><TR><TD><SCRIPT>++rectanglecount;var a = Math.random(); var zzzzadslotzzzz= a * 100000;document.write('<scr' + 'ipt src=""http://ad.doubleclick.net/adj/concreteproducts.iclick.com/adtarget;abr=!webtv;page=concrete_safety_integrity_key;subss=;subs=;area=mag;site=concreteproducts;kw=;sz=180x150;tile=' + rectanglecount + ';pos=rectangle' + rectanglecount + ';ord=' + zzzzadslotzzzz + '></scr' + 'ipt>');</SCRIPT><SCRIPT src="http://ad.doubleclick.net/adj/concreteproducts.iclick.com/adtarget;abr=!webtv;page=concrete_safety_integrity_key;subss=;subs=;area=mag;site=concreteproducts;kw=;sz=180x150;tile=1;pos=rectangle1;ord=94784.53761102716"></SCRIPT>http://ad.doubleclick.net/click;h=v...702215|1;;?http://oe.pbsub.com/dnnsubform.asp<SCRIPT> if ((!document.images && navigator.userAgent.indexOf('Mozilla/2.') >= 0) || navigator.userAgent.indexOf("WebTV")>= 0) {document.write('');document.write(' ') } </SCRIPT> <NOSCRIPT> </NOSCRIPT></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
A prime example of this new approach to high-rise construction was
seen in late June when New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg
signed a law upgrading the safety of such buildings. Based
on recommendations of the New York City Mayoral Commission,
the measure bans the use of open-web steel joists for structures
more than 75 ft. tall because fire-proofing used to protect these
floor-framing systems is inadequate. The law effectively eliminates
one of two steel floor systems that compete with concrete.

http://concreteproducts.com/mag/concrete_safety_integrity_key/

UWinSports · Feb 21, 2005

Shitt happens

stucco43 · Feb 21, 2005

Silverstien had a $7billion insurance on WTC1,2 and 7

WTC 7: The Signature
of a 9/11 Demolition

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<CENTER><TABLE cellPadding=7 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD>The photo above is WTC 7 at roughly 3 p.m. This 5..2 MB MOV video also shows WTC 7 at this time. If the FEMA collapse report were true then the fires shown should have been burning throughout entire floors, not just in a few rooms.

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Larry Silverstein, the controller of the destroyed WTC complex, stated plainly in a PBS documentary that he and the FDNY decided jointly to demolish the Solomon Bros. building, or WTC 7, late in the afternoon of Tuesday, Sept. 11, 2001.

In the documentary "America Rebuilds", aired September 2002, Silverstein makes the following statement;

"I remember getting a call from the, er, fire department commander, telling me that they were not sure they were gonna be able to contain the fire, and I said, 'We've had such terrible loss of life, maybe the smartest thing to do is pull it.' And they made that decision to pull and we watched the building collapse." [mp3]

In the same program a cleanup worker referred to the demolition of WTC 6: "... we're getting ready to pull the building six." [mp3]

There can be little doubt as to how the word "pull" is being used in this context.

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<CENTER><TABLE cellPadding=7 width=600 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD>Firemen evacuated the area as they prepared for the collapse of Building Seven. [Ground Zero Spirit]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></CENTER>

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9/11 Videos:

The Controlled Collapse of WTC 7

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<CENTER><TABLE cellPadding=7 width=600 bgColor=#d8d8d8 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD>Molten steel was found “three, four, and five weeks later, when the rubble was being removed [from WTCs 1 & 2],” Loizeaux said. He said molten steel was also found at 7 WTC, which collapsed mysteriously in the late afternoon. [American Free Press] Molten steel is a byproduct of a thermite reaction.

Wired New York reported "steel members in the debris pile that appear to have been partly evaporated in extraordinarily high temperatures".

Burning diesel can't produce enough heat to melt steel, so it certainly can't evaporate it, but thermite can.

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Consider the facts:

The fires in WTC 7 were not evenly distributed, so a perfect collapse was impossible.
Firemen anticipated the building's collapse (even though fire had never brought down a large fire-protected steel building prior to 9/11).
Silverstein said of the building "the smartest thing to do is pull it."
WTC 7 subsequently collapsed perfectly into its footprint at freefall speed.
Molten steel and partially evaporated steel members were found in the debris.

There can be only one conclusion as to what happened to WTC 7: it was demolished.

The fires in WTC 7 were supposedly started by the collapse of WTC 1 meaning there would have been no time the rig the building for demolition on 9/11, therefore this had to have been done whilst the building was still occupied prior to 9/11.

Doesn't this strike you as an odd and dangerous thing to do? If there were no terrorist attacks on 9/11 then a disgruntled employee could have brought down WTC 7 simply by thumping a red button - it makes no sense whatsoever.

There had to be a very good reason for this building to be rigged for demolition whilst it was still occupied. Did Silverstein, the new WTC owner who wisely invested in insurance against terrorism, have prior knowledge of the attacks?

One thing is for sure, his decision to 'pull' WTC 7 would have delighted many people:

<CENTER><TABLE borderColor=#000000 cellPadding=7 width=600 bgColor=#d8d8d8 borderColorLight=#c0c0c0 border=1><TBODY><TR><TD>The SEC has not quantified the number of active cases in which substantial files were destroyed [in the collapse of WTC 7]. Reuters news service and the Los Angeles Times published reports estimating them at 3,000 to 4,000. They include the agency's major inquiry into the manner in which investment banks divvied up hot shares of initial public offerings during the high-tech boom. ..."Ongoing investigations at the New York SEC will be dramatically affected because so much of their work is paper-intensive," said Max Berger of New York's Bernstein Litowitz Berger & Grossmann. "This is a disaster for these cases." [New York Lawyer] Citigroup says some information that the committee is seeking [about WorldCom] was destroyed in the Sept. 11 terror attack on the World Trade Center. Salomon had offices in 7 World Trade Center, one of the buildings that collapsed in the aftermath of the attack. The bank says that back-up tapes of corporate emails from September 1998 through December 2000 were stored at the building and destroyed in the attack. [TheStreet]

Inside [WTC 7 was] the US Secret Service's largest field office with more than 200 employees. ..."All the evidence that we stored at 7 World Trade, in all our cases, went down with the building," according to US Secret Service Special Agent David Curran. [TechTV]

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eek. · Feb 21, 2005

oh no.

stucco's hijacked my thread...

The fire dudes butted out because the floor truss system was suspect.
On 9/11 they basically said that if there was no-one in the building and there was no fúcking way they were going to run around in there if no-one was at risk.

Have you been in a fire son? a real fire?
The heat blisters your ears, and when your ears start to melt, its time to get out. Your ears are your temperature gauges.

stucco43 · Feb 21, 2005

Americans are smarter than this!!!!

3 weeks before 9-11 the lease was transfered on WTC1,2,7 to Mr.silverstien....under the insurance the buildings were covered for terrorist activitys....good timing...last month a jury awarded $7billion to the guy...he claimed it were 2 different events....the insurance was for $3billion....lucky for him...also he stated on record to pull the building which means destroy it...which means to pull it the explosive were already in the building....and why would he decide to pull it

check the building out in madrid same steel it still is standing after 2 days of fire....You still believe that fire melted the beems...

Madrid stands and the WTC falls

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This building had same design as the WTC but withstood a blazing two day fire.

Maybe there is more to the WTC collapse.

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Number13 · Feb 21, 2005

WTC 1,2, and 7 were not three separate buildings but were a part of a large interconnected complex. Underneath these buildings were several stories of substructure, including subway stations and a shopping mall. When 1 and 2 collapsed the entire substructure was weakened, so it was inevitable that anything else built on this substructure would also eventually collapse into it.

stucco43 · Feb 21, 2005

like i said....they were pulled...enough said...

eek. · Feb 21, 2005

WTC 7 was on top of a substation, a solid lump of steel and concrete.
the building collapsed, the foundations from the original structure are being used for the construction of the new structure ya big muppet.

In the last couple of years NYC has changed its building standards to exclude steel floor trusses with spray on fire proofing.

The bottom line is the Fire Fighters will not touch these places.

Ask a NYC firefighter for a list of those structures.

It brings out the cynic in me, but NYC firefighters will now want to know which buildings are going to fall down when the going gets hot.