Should New Orleans be left to mother nature?

[eek.]

<TABLE class=storycontent cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0><TBODY><TR><TD colSpan=2>New Orleans residents flee storm


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<!-- caption -->Mayor Ray Nagin used emotive language to announce the evacuation
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New Orleans residents have been fleeing in their thousands after the city's mayor ordered an evacuation ahead of Hurricane Gustav's expected landfall.
Roads out of the Louisiana port have been crammed with traffic and authorities have been helping those unable to leave by their own means.
Gustav, set to hit the US Gulf Coast on Monday, was described by Mayor Ray Nagin as "the storm of the century".
It comes three years after Hurricane Katrina devastated New Orleans. <!-- E SF -->
In 2005, three-quarters of the city was flooded after a storm surge breached its protective levees. More than 1,800 people died in coastal areas.
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</TD><TD class=sibtbg>FLASHBACK TO KATRINA

Katrina struck US Gulf Coast in August 2005 as a category three storm, killing more than 1,800 people
New Orleans was 80% flooded after storm surge breached protective levees
US Government was blamed for slow, botched response that exacerbated disaster
Hundreds of thousands of people were displaced

<!-- S ILIN -->Flashback: Hurricane Katrina
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Gustav weakened to a category three storm (with winds of up to 125mph; 201kph) after hitting Cuba overnight, but was expected to regain strength in the Gulf of Mexico before making landfall on the US Gulf Coast.
At least 300,000 people were evacuated in Cuba as the storm brought extensive flooding and some severe damage, but no reports of fatalities.
The BBC's Kevin Connolly, in New Orleans, says Mr Nagin spoke in "passionate and desperate" terms, telling a televised news conference the storm was "so powerful" and growing more powerful every day.
"I'm not sure we've seen anything like it," he told reporters at City Hall.
He warned that in the West Bank area of New Orleans, the highest levees were just eight to 10 feet, and were at risk from storm surges that could be as high as 24 feet.
The floodwalls of the Harvey Canal - a waterway designed to protect residents from surges in Lake Pontchartrain - were not yet completed, the mayor said, warning that water would "punch through holes" and flood nearby areas.
"If you are stubborn enough, if you are not taking this as seriously as we need you to take it, and if you decide to stay; you are on your own," he said.
"Anyone who decides to stay, I'll say it like I said it before Katrina: make sure you have an axe, because you will be carving your way, or busting your way out of your attic to get on your roof with waters that you will be surrounded with in this event."
'We're feeling very insecure'
Hundreds of thousands of people are already thought to have obeyed the mayor's order to flee, clogging roadways, emptying petrol stations of fuel and jamming phone networks.
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</TD><TD class=sibtbg>HURRICANE CATEGORIES
FIVE: Winds over 155mph (249km/h). Storm surge more than 18ft (5.4m) above normal. Only three such US landfall hurricanes - Labour Day 1935, Camille 1969 and Andrew 1992
FOUR: Winds 131-155mph. Storm surge 13-18ft
THREE: Winds 111-130mph. Storm surge 9-12ft. Katrina hit New Orleans as a three.
TWO: Winds 96-110mph. Storm surge 6-8ft
ONE: Winds 74-95mph. Storm surge 4-5ft

Source: Saffir-Simpson Scale/US National Hurricane Centre

<!-- S ILIN -->In pictures: New Orleans evacuation
<!-- E ILIN --><!-- S ILIN -->In pictures: Hurricane Gustav
<!-- E ILIN --><!-- S ILIN -->Preparing for Gustav
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At the city's main transit terminal, reports said a line snaked for more than a mile as residents with no other means of getting out waited to board buses bound for shelters in north Louisiana and beyond.
Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal, in New Orleans to observe the evacuation taking place, said about 700 people an hour could be flown out of the city.
Sarah Debacher, who has lived in New Orleans for 10 years and is preparing to leave her home for the fourth time, told the BBC she was feeling more anxious this time round.
"The failure of the federal levees after Hurricane Katrina meant that we experienced devastation that we shouldn't have experienced.
"We don't know, frankly we don't have a lot of faith in the work that's been done to repair the damage that was caused by those failures and by the storm. So, this time we're feeling very insecure."
City, state and federal officials will be mindful that the reaction to Gustav will be closely scrutinised, not least because the slow and uncoordinated response to Hurricane Katrina was blamed for exacerbating the 2005 disaster.
Eric Blake, from the US National Hurricane Centre in Florida, told the BBC Mr Nagin may have over-stated the size of the hurricane.
"I think that may be a bit of an exaggeration. I mean, they already had Hurricane Katrina, and right now this is no Hurricane Katrina. But we still think it will be a large and powerful hurricane and a significant threat."
Republican convention doubts
Hours before Mr Nagin spoke, a hurricane watch was put in place along America's North Gulf coast, from Texas along to the Alabama-Florida border.
Republican party presidential candidate John McCain and his running mate Sarah Palin were travelling to Mississippi on Sunday to observe storm preparations.
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Predicted route of Hurricane Gustav (30 August 2008)

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Republican officials are considering what to do about the party's National Convention (due to open on Monday) depending on when and where the storm hits.
Mr McCain hinted there might be changes to the tone of the gathering, rather than a cancellation of the event.
He told Fox News: "You know it just wouldn't be appropriate to have a festive occasion while a near tragedy or a terrible challenge is presented in the form of a natural disaster, so we're monitoring it from day to day and I'm saying a few prayers, too."
The hurricane has already claimed the lives of more than 80 people in the Caribbean. It has swept through Haiti, the Dominican Republic and Jamaica over the past week, causing widespread damage. It has strengthened rapidly from a tropical storm to a Category 4 hurricane, and is expected to grow to a Category 5 storm - the maximum on the scale - as it crosses the Gulf of Mexico.
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/7590426.stm

 

[billhill999]

The city is five feet below sea level for Gods sake, surrounded by two huge body of waters.
Citizens of the city should know this going in and living there has the same inevitable dangers as say the Californians that live along the earthquake faults.
Decades ago, the engineers that built the levees thought they were high and strong enough, but there is only so much you can do.
How high is high?
What the government should do is to provide the resources to make sure the citizens get out safe, do all they can to protect their possesions, but like I said, there is only so much that can be done, let nature take it's course.

 

[roadreeler57]

Theres no misissippi mud silt plain buffer south of New Orleans like there used to be either...Lost at so many acres per week... I say ditch it too but they probably won't...Mardi Gras where?

 

[tiznow]

think its gonna continue to weaken hopefully i'm right

not looking too good for now

wind shear continues to hinder its development since it left cuba

could mainly just be a rain event in the end

 

[C-Gold]

Katrina was George Bush's fault.

 

[realestatepro]

The city is five feet below sea level for Gods sake, surrounded by two huge body of waters.
Citizens of the city should know this going in and living there has the same inevitable dangers as say the Californians that live along the earthquake faults.
Decades ago, the engineers that built the levees thought they were high and strong enough, but there is only so much you can do.
How high is high?
What the government should do is to provide the resources to make sure the citizens get out safe, do all they can to protect their possesions, but like I said, there is only so much that can be done, let nature take it's course.

Many cities are. Overpopulation has led to people living in areas unfit for living. I guess people would rather live 5ft below sea level than in the middle of Nebraska.

 

[tiznow]

although at the same time its gonna be a mess if he does get his act together again

he's really increased his size

who knows at this point such a hard call could be anywhere from a monster cat 4 to weakening cat 1 at landfall

 

[Devilsadvocate+]

What insurance company would ever insure homes or businesses in this area? Very risky and the risk/reward is way too high.

 

[tiznow]

down to 956 mb strenghtening a bit in that area but wind field has expanded and now a cat 2 storm as far as wind

seems like its holding its own for the time being its a dangerous storm but not apocalytic and probably won't be......

wind not really an issue anyway for NO at least....wake is....

the bigger in size they are the lower the winds vs. their pressure....pressure better sign of overall strength and wake it'll bring....but katrina got down to 902 and landed as 920....this guy lowest point 941 and now 956

should be interesting to see how it all affects NO they won't take a direct hit unless something changes just a matter of how close to the west it hits and as it gets near land supposed to veer to the left.....

we shall see....tomorrow we'll all find out

 

[tiznow]

winds back up to cat 3 and 953 on pressure

looks like its getting its act together unfortunately

direction it comes at will make a difference for NO and so many variables at play so hard to say how bad its gonna be for the bowl they called NO (already got some squalls starting to come in)...places like houma, la which looks to be ground zero for now looks to be in deep shit

 

[billhill999]

Many cities are. Overpopulation has led to people living in areas unfit for living. I guess people would rather live 5ft below sea level than in the middle of Nebraska.

Yeah, but the cities that are below sea level aren't surrounded by mass quantity of water.

 

[tiznow]

What insurance company would ever insure homes or businesses in this area? Very risky and the risk/reward is way too high.

that's what big government and FEMA is for thanks liberal dubya hno:

maybe we can spend billions trying to secure a city in a bowl again if it does end up hitting it good

---------------

starting to look not so good for the gulf coast wherever it hits and damages.....its really getting its act together at the wrong time....when its 13-16 hours away from landfall

 

[festeringZit]

Katrina was George Bush's fault.

Gustav is Bush's fault too, and Cheney.

 

[tiznow]

looks like pesky dry air messing with him again thankfully pressure slowly coming back up again

looks like steady state likely till landfall hitting as a cat 2 or cat 3.....with pressure in the 940-960 range

what's done has been done as far as surge anyway strengthening or weakening at this point ain't really gonna have much effect on that end of things......that builds up from earlier in the gulf

angle of entry to US mainland and location wise history points to betsy 1965 who was a strong cat 3 when she hit....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurricane_Betsy

 

[DeathEatsaCracker]

How many times are we going to rebuild this goddamn city? Let Mother Nature have it before she takes it by force.

 

[festeringZit]

How many times are we going to rebuild this goddamn city? Let Mother Nature have it before she takes it by force.

Wow, cracker and I almost agree on something.

arty:

 

[tiznow]

its a cat 2 now or lower end cat 3....but looks like it might come closer to NO than thought we'll see how much surge/flooding they get and how the levees hold up

eye on the radar now

http://radar.weather.gov/ridge/radar.php?rid=LIX&product=N0Z&overlay=11101111&loop=yes

 

[tiznow]

well pretty much going due west as it hugs the LA coast we'll see if helps out NO in the end....not official landfall yet need eye more inland but its right up against the coast now

 

[mamatried]

Who needs the weather channel when you've got Tiznow?

Bottom line, most of the posters here are right (a rarity for some of them). It was ridiculous to try to rebuild the city in the first place. Until the natural barriers are reestablished (and even then) the city's ultimate destruction is inevitable. The people still there should have done what most of the others did - pack up, move out and start over.

Of course, whenever you say something like this you run the risk of being called a racist by the Spike Lees of the world, who actually have convinced themselves and others that the Government caused the levees to overflow during Katrina.

 

[tiznow]

think they dodged a big bullet in the end category 2 and keeps going away from NO upon landfall

we'll see if the levees hold on the western part of the city the main worry an area that didn't get effected during katrina