Is the US Prison System Working?

[KMAN]

Another thread got me thinking about this...

What is the goal of the US prison system? And is it achieving it's goal?

Is it to rehabiliate criminals into decent human beings again or just give them a place to chill for awhile and hope they don't commit the same crime again when they get out?

What's wrong with chain gangs like they had in the past? Criminals should be doing all kinds of community service like collecting garbage along side of the road.

I don't believe Prison should be a place of comfort. Maybe that's just me but shouldn't we make prison so bad that people are scared to go there?????? They don't need cable television, cigarettes, etc.... For some of these criminals prison life is better than what they live in at home.... That's not right.

What do you think?

 

[terps1313]

And I guess you know from experience how bad it is in their? My brother went to jail for 5 hours for being drunk and peeing in public... basically being a stupid college kid. They threw him in a cell with a convicted rapist. He said it was the worst 5 hours of his life, and since then he has been a better person all around. so it has worked on someone i know very well.
​

 

[Massmilwaukee]

Wow.

You watch too much tv.

Are you saying you wouldn't mind going to prison KMAN? If it is such a holiday...



My opinion is one of... why does the US have the highest prison population per capita in the world? We incarcerate people for everything in this country. It is quite unbelievable.

 

[KMAN]

And I guess you know from experience how bad it is in their? My brother went to jail for 5 hours for being drunk and peeing in public... basically being a stupid college kid. They threw him in a cell with a convicted rapist. He said it was the worst 5 hours of his life, and since then he has been a better person all around. so it has worked on someone i know very well.​

That is another failure on the prison system, in my opinion they need to group people together so child molestors can molest other child molestors, those who get caught peeing in public are in the same cells as less violent people.... I'm glad your brother made it out.

 

[KMAN]

Wow.

You watch too much tv.

Are you saying you wouldn't mind going to prison KMAN? If it is such a holiday...



My opinion is one of... why does the US have the highest prison population per capita in the world? We incarcerate people for everything in this country. It is quite unbelievable.

Why don't you enlighten us as to what prison is like then??? and what crimes would you like to see go away?

 

[bblight]

At one time when my wife and I were more naive about life, we tried to pay back society by doing foster care - maybe help a kid or two.

What a disaster.

Most of these kids have been told all of their lives how bad they have it and that society owes them a debt - and these kids really believe it. To them, a criminal record is a badge of honor and many of them can't wait to do "real time". In school, they've learned to "act out" with authority and are allowed to do almost anything non-violent without suffering any kind of consequences - sometimes they're rewarded with a 3 day suspension. These kids get a clothing allownce of abot $300 each quarter and some of them get SSI money each month ("crazy" money) with which they can buy large items such as a computer or even a car.

When these kids hit 18, they leave the system - move into a "transitional living" facility and are expected to start making it on their own - the problem is that these kids have no education and no respect for authority. Although they've been told, they don't fully understand that they're now adults and will suffer adult consequences for their actions. With their lack of education and disdain for authority, they can't hold down a job. One thing leads to another and pretty soon the girls that hadn't already gotten pregnant do so with immediate dispatch, they get an apartment, furniture and all kinds of goodies along with the baby, while the boys start doing drugs and crimes and quickly end up back in the system - this time in prison rather than foster care.

It's a shame to say it but many of these kids are taught how to be criminals from the very beginning.

This is the truth!

You'll never see a study telling you how many of these foster care kids end up in prison, but I'd bet a ton of money it's a very large number.

 

[terps1313]

Wow, you are basing the entire foster care system on 2 kids. Then go on to spit out a bunch of statements, none of which have any facts attached to them. Ah I guess your solution is just f all of them, and throw them in gutters. That seems to be the usual conservative approach to all non white americans.

 

[JinnRikki]

That's odd bb, I have a good friend who has done foster care for over twenty years. In that time he has cared for some two dozen at risk children adopting 5 of them (not that it matters but all the kids were black and they are white). Two of the kids are in college and two have graduated.
He says it is the most rewarding thing he and his wife have ever done.

 

[Massmilwaukee]

Why don't you enlighten us as to what prison is like then??? and what crimes would you like to see go away?

The idea of prison scares 99.99% of the population. The .01% of the population that isn't scared by prison are the convicts that know nothing else and are stuck in the machine. I know many people who have fucked up really badly and served their time. The problem exists that they are now apart of "the machine". Anytime they have to go to court again, no matter how petty the crime, the first thing the prosecuter brings up is the "wrap sheet". This totally skews any judgement and ultimately 30, 45, 60, 90 days back in prison becomes an answer to just about any court appearance. Doing some time doesn't just inhibit these people from holding down any normal job, if they can find any normal job, but leading any sort of normal life. After they serve time, it is hard to become a member of society again, it is difficult to get one's shit together and many times they really have nothing to lose. I can get away with this armed robbery and make off with $2k and live well for a couple of months, or I can get caught and know I have a meal three times a day. What is there to lose?

Don't jail people for the stupid shit, no matter how many times they do it. It is a waste of money, police and court resources and ultimately leads to otherwise good people being forced into one specific route in their life. Keep a database for felons, but when a felon is released, unless they are threat to themselves or others, don't let employers search that DB. These people are forced pariahs.

 

[bblight]

That's odd bb, I have a good friend who has done foster care for over twenty years. In that time he has cared for some two dozen at risk children adopting 5 of them (not that it matters but all the kids were black and they are white). Two of the kids are in college and two have graduated.
He says it is the most rewarding thing he and his wife have ever done.

I'm condemning the system and not the kids.

Discuss my "accusation" with your friend - better yet, try foster care yourself - then come back and tell me I'm wrong.

Meanwhile, my experience gives me the belief that our prisons are loaded with kids that come from the foster care system. As I noted, I doubt we'll ever see the statistics since they would exihibit what a failure the system is.

 

[docmercer]

This is from a DOJ survey done 16 years ago. They use the vague term of "most" so it might be misleading since some kids might spend 12 years with mom, then go into foster care for 4 years and then run away or whatever.

 

[KMAN]

The idea of prison scares 99.99% of the population. The .01% of the population that isn't scared by prison are the convicts that know nothing else and are stuck in the machine. I know many people who have fucked up really badly and served their time. The problem exists that they are now apart of "the machine". Anytime they have to go to court again, no matter how petty the crime, the first thing the prosecuter brings up is the "wrap sheet". This totally skews any judgement and ultimately 30, 45, 60, 90 days back in prison becomes an answer to just about any court appearance. Doing some time doesn't just inhibit these people from holding down any normal job, if they can find any normal job, but leading any sort of normal life. After they serve time, it is hard to become a member of society again, it is difficult to get one's shit together and many times they really have nothing to lose. I can get away with this armed robbery and make off with $2k and live well for a couple of months, or I can get caught and know I have a meal three times a day. What is there to lose?

Don't jail people for the stupid shit, no matter how many times they do it. It is a waste of money, police and court resources and ultimately leads to otherwise good people being forced into one specific route in their life. Keep a database for felons, but when a felon is released, unless they are threat to themselves or others, don't let employers search that DB. These people are forced pariahs.

Well, what do you consider stupid shit????

And also, you said "anytime they have to go to court again".... AGAIN???? It's not that hard to stay out of court.... Just follow the damn rules... This proves my point... Evidentally your friends didn't find jailed frightening enough to stay out of court...

 

[JoeContrarian]

The idea of prison scares 99.99% of the population. The .01% of the population that isn't scared by prison are the convicts that know nothing else and are stuck in the machine. I know many people who have fucked up really badly and served their time. The problem exists that they are now apart of "the machine". Anytime they have to go to court again, no matter how petty the crime, the first thing the prosecuter brings up is the "wrap sheet". This totally skews any judgement and ultimately 30, 45, 60, 90 days back in prison becomes an answer to just about any court appearance. Doing some time doesn't just inhibit these people from holding down any normal job, if they can find any normal job, but leading any sort of normal life. After they serve time, it is hard to become a member of society again, it is difficult to get one's shit together and many times they really have nothing to lose. I can get away with this armed robbery and make off with $2k and live well for a couple of months, or I can get caught and know I have a meal three times a day. What is there to lose?

Don't jail people for the stupid shit, no matter how many times they do it. It is a waste of money, police and court resources and ultimately leads to otherwise good people being forced into one specific route in their life. Keep a database for felons, but when a felon is released, unless they are threat to themselves or others, don't let employers search that DB. These people are forced pariahs.

:nopityA: :cryingcry

 

[Coldweather]

This here system is not working. If I were in charge is would work cuz I know what to do.

:toast: :toast: :toast:

 

[JoeContrarian]

So do I, CW. Start with castration for convicted pedophiles and rapists, bring back slave labor for all convicts (no more country club prisons), and work down the list...

And yes, three meals a day is a country club, relative to those who have to live with the emotional grief and trauma of a brutal rape or murder for the rest of their lives.

 

[Masxmenos]

The 22 year old kid who beat the pulp out of the 91 Year old WWII Vet in Detroit for his car deserves a 69 Year sentence w/o parole options (he qualifies for life). My theory on that is he will be 91 when when he gets out if he does 69 years.

Very disgusting act on that 22 year old's part. Some 21 punches were said to have been thrown.

 

[Massmilwaukee]

Well, what do you consider stupid shit????

And also, you said "anytime they have to go to court again".... AGAIN???? It's not that hard to stay out of court.... Just follow the damn rules... This proves my point... Evidentally your friends didn't find jailed frightening enough to stay out of court...

Jesus Christ... haven't we been over this multiple times on this forum.

1. Any sort of possession.
2. Any petty larceny, petty theft, and any number of misdemeanors.

I thought I was fairly eloquent in stating that once you are in the system, it is very, very difficult to get out. It is nearly impossible for you to land a job and if you do, you're making $7.50/hr busting your ass. If you're lucky enough to find something that makes your life worth while, a woman/man, a child, a hobby, a job, prison becomes a scary place again, but if you never find that... YOU DON'T HAVE ANYTHING TO LOSE. Those with nothing to lose can't be scared by anything. Haven't you ever met anyone like that?

 

[919]

At one time when my wife and I were more naive about life, we tried to pay back society by doing foster care - maybe help a kid or two.

What a disaster.

Most of these kids have been told all of their lives how bad they have it and that society owes them a debt - and these kids really believe it. To them, a criminal record is a badge of honor and many of them can't wait to do "real time". In school, they've learned to "act out" with authority and are allowed to do almost anything non-violent without suffering any kind of consequences - sometimes they're rewarded with a 3 day suspension. These kids get a clothing allownce of abot $300 each quarter and some of them get SSI money each month ("crazy" money) with which they can buy large items such as a computer or even a car.

When these kids hit 18, they leave the system - move into a "transitional living" facility and are expected to start making it on their own - the problem is that these kids have no education and no respect for authority. Although they've been told, they don't fully understand that they're now adults and will suffer adult consequences for their actions. With their lack of education and disdain for authority, they can't hold down a job. One thing leads to another and pretty soon the girls that hadn't already gotten pregnant do so with immediate dispatch, they get an apartment, furniture and all kinds of goodies along with the baby, while the boys start doing drugs and crimes and quickly end up back in the system - this time in prison rather than foster care.

It's a shame to say it but many of these kids are taught how to be criminals from the very beginning.

This is the truth!

You'll never see a study telling you how many of these foster care kids end up in prison, but I'd bet a ton of money it's a very large number.

Maybe you were just a bad foster parent.

 

[bblight]

Maybe you were just a bad foster parent.

Maybe.

But I tried, which is more than you can say for yourself.

 

[billhill999]

We are soft with the death penalty.
I'd like to see some of these worthless scums convicted of murder be put to death instead of life behind bars.

That'll alliveiate some of the prsion space.