Evolution is faith driven so why is it taught in schools

[Hobbes]

"sure there are people in the world who do good...who are kind and have compassion on others. those people usually follow a moral compass which has its roots in a belief in God."

Most of 'em aren't Christian, so as a Christian what point are you proving here?

 

[DarrylParsons]

human nature evil? well, you tell me. the world i see is full of:

- racism
- people living in disease and poverty while their governments do nothing
- nations who hate each other to the point that they will kill themselves to take a few of them out
- overcrowded prisions
- slums where people sell each drugs which will destroy their lives
- rapant child sexual abuse
- people cheating on their spouses all the time

sure there are people in the world who do good...who are kind and have compassion on others. those people usually follow a moral compass which has its roots in a belief in God.

The animal kingdom has similar stuff:

- stealing each other's food
- the strongest male shagging all the females while the rest get nothing
- killing or leaving to die those who don't join the pack and co-operate

Are they evil too? Is this whole thing called life evil? Should chimpanzees also accept Jesus Christ as their savior or is there a chimp equivalent of Christ who died for their sins? Not trying to be a smartass here, just wondering what you think.

 

[kayaman+]

"and, if an all-powerful God decides that the way he will communicate his plan for mankind is through a book which details the lives of people who lived thousands of years ago, who are you to say that that method is no good?"

If God is all powerful can he make a stone so large that he can't move it?

If the Bible has been intrepreted so many times by man in so many languages how much can we be sure it is factual? Take the dark ages for example, where literature was nearly lost, saved by monks copying books by hand. How do we really know no that man has not added his two cents here and there throughout the ages?

 

[blueedwards]

The animal kingdom has similar stuff:

- stealing each other's food
- the strongest male shagging all the females while the rest get nothing
- killing or leaving to die those who don't join the pack and co-operate

Are they evil too? Is this whole thing called life evil? Should chimpanzees also accept Jesus Christ as their savior or is there a chimp equivalent of Christ who died for their sins? Not trying to be a smartass here, just wondering what you think.

dp, the only point i was trying to make here is that human nature is not good. if i lived my life only by what i felt was "right" at the time, i would do many things that i would consider evil.

 

[blueedwards]

"sure there are people in the world who do good...who are kind and have compassion on others. those people usually follow a moral compass which has its roots in a belief in God."

Most of 'em aren't Christian, so as a Christian what point are you proving here?

in this quote, i am not proving any thing about christianity...just saying that most of the "good" done in this world is done by people who believe in God. not necessarily the God of the new testament.

 

[kayaman+]

"in this quote, i am not proving any thing about christianity...just saying that most of the "good" done in this world is done by people who believe in God. not necessarily the God of the new testament."

Knowing that only about 33% (World Almanac, christian God and you have to include mormons) of the world believes in God makes that premise hard to believe.
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[xpanda]

I think Jesus was a real and good man, the beautitudes are also a guide to how we can live good lives. You seem to think human nature is evil.... I don't.

I was thinking about this discussion this morning for some reason, and was thinking precisely this exact thing. I do believe in Jesus - in that I believe he existed - and the beatitudes are beautiful. I am always reminded of this:

Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth.

.. when I think about current US politics and the religiosity creeping in. I wonder if perhaps this one shouldn't be engraved in statue at the front of the Supreme Court, rather than the Ten Commandments.

 

[xpanda]

in this quote, i am not proving any thing about christianity...just saying that most of the "good" done in this world is done by people who believe in God. not necessarily the God of the new testament.

But, Blue, isn't it also true that much evil is done in the name of god? Priests molesting little boys, planes being flown into buildings, heads being lopped off, countries being invaded ... none of these are 'good' works by any stretch of the imagination. They are motivated by absolutism and self-righteousness, that very thing that is preventing you from accepting scientific evidence of evolution (thankfully this ommission on your part doesn't hurt anyone at least.) The closed-mindedness of organised religion has done more damage to human societies than it has good. There are more examples of humans changing things for the good by rejecting religion as a social organiser than by their acceptance of it. Take the Enlightenment, for example. Even Jesus eroded the religious corruption of his day.

 

[kayaman+]

Besides that Panda if you take into account the Crusades and the Spanish Inquisition you could make the arguement that Christianity has done more bad than good.

 

[blueedwards]

guys, there are a lot of differing opinions here and its clear that not everyone will agree. to be honest, i am getting a little worn out on this discussion so, i think this will be my last post in this thread.

a couple things...yes, there has been a lot of things done in the name of God that have been very evil. my opinion is that those things are a perfect example of human nature being evil and corrupting and perverting something intended for good into evil.

as far as only 33% of the world believing in God...i think that number is very low. i don't know what the right number is but, i suspect it is far greater than 33%. also, i think that most (not all) of the good done in this world...feeding starving people, housing the homeless, caring for those with disease, giving to charities that help people out of dire situations, etc...is done by people who beleive in God. i am not saying that 100% of the people who are kind believe in God. i am also not saying that everyone who believes in God is compassionate.

peace, out.

 

[kayaman+]

Blue, that came out of the World Almanac a few years ago, may have changed slightly but I wouldn't expect anything drastic. It shouldn't really be a surprising number if you think about the number of oriental and arabic people in the world.
Even if you say it's as high as 40% I still find it hard to believe that a majority of the good done in the world is done by Christians, how many doctors could there be in China, just as an example.

Anyway nice thread Blue, we don't agree on much but I do respect you as a bright guy.

 

[xpanda]

Well, Blue, you lasted alot longer than truthteller, who started this thread. And you were kinda ganged up on, so kudos for sticking with it this long.

As for creationism being taught in science class -- well, obviously it's your education system and you can do what you want with it. But I think I'd be pulling my kids out of public school pretty quickly and send them somewhere more pragmatic.

 

[Hobbes]

Religion has served a purpose in advancing liberty to the extent it invalidated the concept of state supremacy...

 

[Woody0]

I was watching a programme on T.V last night where it quoted an evolutionist as saying the chances of life coming from evolution is 10 followed by 39 thousand zeroes.

Just shows you how much unrefuted and unsubstantiated garbage you are subjected to on TV these days.

 

[Woody0]

...the big bang theory doesn't even begin to answer that because you can go further back and ask how the conditions for the big bang originated etc.

Geez DP I thought a smart guy like you had figured that out.

God simply altered one of the basic laws of physics.

 

[Woody0]

I'm sure you've figured it out but the command was reported to be: "Let there be light".