Can someone answer me this....?

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TheRightWing

TheRightWing

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I don't think she will ever get better so I do think she should die but die somewhat peacefuly which I hope she is...but if she's in a hospital why couldn't her parents just say were taking her home today? Or is this her husband and he said nope she stays here and dies. I just find it weird that over time and all this hoopla why can't her care givers say hey.....we are taking her home to care for her now.
 
Jointpleasure

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exactomundo!
 
JudgeWapner

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Very good question.
 
kingbill

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I believe it comes down to what the woman wanted, not her parents or the government.

I know myself I wouldn't want to be kept alive if I were in a vegetative state.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>

Really it shouldn't be the governments business or my parents it should be between my wife and myself. I would be pissed if the government had that much control over my life or death.<o:p></o:p>
 
JDeuce

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Right Wing...

Her husband is her legal guardian...not her parents. They have absolutely no say in what is happening to her.

Her husband is not relieving his duties of P.O.A., and feels he is abiding by her wishes by trying to let her die via removal of the feeding tube.

I agree with kingbill though...I don't think this should be a federal issue.
 
xpanda

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RW: I think it's pretty safe to say that if her parents took her home, they would find a way to begin feeding her again. It might be court-ordered that she stay in the hospital where she can at least be monitored by doctors.

I wonder if the US gov't understands the enormous sense of false hope they dumped on her parents? Like they haven't been through enough ...
 

TheAce

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xpanda said:
RW: I think it's pretty safe to say that if her parents took her home, they would find a way to begin feeding her again. It might be court-ordered that she stay in the hospital where she can at least be monitored by doctors.

I wonder if the US gov't understands the enormous sense of false hope they dumped on her parents? Like they haven't been through enough ...
Good points.
 
one9

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I agree with you Kingbill. It is no one else's business, nor should it be..period.
 

919

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After Florida passed “Terri’s Law” in 2003, Jeb Bush had to appoint a Guardian Ad Litem (GAL). I am not a lawyer, but my understanding is that a GAL is a neutral party who helps the court cut through the mud slinging and get to the truth. This GAL was to spend 30 days investigating and report back to Gov. Bush. His report,, (pdf) is excellent reading for anyone who is interested in the history of this case. The GAL details everything from the family relations to the court cases to the medical information. It is also very readable which is helpful.

Some of the interesting parts (all from the GAL report):

From the beginning, Michael appeared from the beginning to be Terri’s best advocate:

Theresa’s husband, Michael Schiavo and her mother, Mary Schindler, were virtual partners in their care of and dedication to Theresa. There is no question but that complete trust, mutual caring, explicit love and a common goal of caring for and rehabilitating Theresa, were the shared intentions of Michael Shiavo and the Schindlers.





His [Michael’s] demanding concern for her well being and meticulous care by the nursing home earned him the characterization by the administrator as “a nursing home administrator’s nightmare”. It is notable that through more than thirteen years after Theresa’s collapse, she has never had a bedsore.


He even went to extraordinary lengths to pursue any treatment that held promise. After “aggressive physical and voice therapy” failed to show signs of improvement,



In late Autumn of 1990, following months of therapy and testing, formal diagnoses of persistent vegetative state with no evidence of improvement, Michael took Theresa to California, where she received an experimental thalamic stimulator implant in her brain. Michael remained in California caring for Theresa during a period of several months and returned to Florida with her in January of 1991.


During all this, for nearly two years, Michael lived with the Schindlers. It was during that time that they even brought Terri home for a period and tried to give her around the clock care with family taking shifts. This proved unworkable and after a couple of months, Terri went back to the skilled nursing facility. Michael struggled with moving on. In fact, it was the Schindlers, Terri’s parents, that urged him to move on romantically:

It took Michael a long time to consider the prospect of getting on with his life – something he was actively encouraged to do by the Schindlers, long before enmity tore them apart. He was even encouraged by the Schindlers to date, and introduced his in-law family to women he was dating.


It was, however, shortly after this that the malpractice settlement happened. The GAL report delicately sidesteps the question of what went wrong between Michael and the Schindlers, but the malpractice settlement appears to be when it happened. Reading between the lines, I got the impression that it was the parents who started the fight, but I could be wrong. So, what about all that money that Terri got in a malpractice settlement?

Michael Schiavo, on Theresa’s and his own behalf, initiated a medical malpractice lawsuit against the obstetrician who had been overseeing Theresa’s fertility therapy. In 1993, the malpractice action concluded in Theresa and Michael’s favor, resulting in a two element award: More than $750,000 in economic damages for Theresa, and a loss of consortium award (non economic damages) of $300,000 to Michael. The court established a trust fund for Theresa’s financial award, with SouthTrust Bank as the Guardian and an independent trustee. This fund was meticulously managed and accounted for and Michael Schiavo had no control over its use. There is no evidence in the record of the trust administration documents of any mismanagement of Theresa’s estate, and the records on this matter are excellently maintained.





Michael Schiavo had earlier, formally offered to divest himself entirely of his financial interest in the guardianship estate [in order to remove any hint of bias in his decision to remove the feeding tube].




I have read in other sources, including quotes from the Schindlers’ attorney that the Schindlers refused to go along with Michael’s plan to disinherit himself. Interestingly, they also are not asking themselves to be the new guardian, but rather they are asking for Terri’s siblings to be appointed guardian.

After several years, the aggressive physical therapy appeared to be not working.

By 1994, Michael’s attitude and perspective about Theresa’s condition changed. During the previous four years, he had insistently held to the premise that Theresa could recover and the evidence is incontrovertible that he gave his heart and soul to her treatment and care. This was in the face of consistent medical reports indicating that there was little or no likelihood for her improvement.


The courts would not let Michael remove the feeding tube though since they needed proof she would want the tube removed. Most media would have you believe he was the only source of that information. It turns out that two others testified as to her wishes. The conversations happened after funerals, which makes quite a lot of sense (and is hard to fake).

The hearings and testimony before the trial court leading to the decision to discontinue artificial life support included admitted hearsay from Theresa’s brother-in-law (Michael Schiavo’s brother) and his wife (Michael’s Schiavo’s sister-in-law) along with testimony from Michael. The testimony of these parties referenced specific conversations in which Theresa commented about her desire never to be placed on artificial life support. The testimony reflected conversations at or proximate to funerals of close family members who had been on artificial life support. The context and content of the testimony, while hearsay, was deemed credible and consistent and was used by the court as a supporting bases for its decision to discontinue artificial life support.


The Schindlers, however, were not willing, under any circumstances, to let Terri die. This is some particularly tragic information and my hat is really off to the GAL who went to some pretty heroic lengths to write this both fairly and with kindness.

The Testimony provided by members of the Schindler family included very personal statements about their desire and intention to ensure that Theresa remain alive. Throughout the course of the litigation, deposition and trial testimony by members of the Schindler family voiced the disturbing belief that they would keep Theresa alive at any and all costs. Nearly gruesome examples were given, eliciting agreement by family members that in the event Theresa should contract diabetes and subsequent gangrene in each of her limbs, they would agree to amputate each limb, and would then, were she to be diagnosed with heart disease, perform open heart surgery. There was additional, difficult testimony that appeared to establish that despite the sad and undesirable condition of Theresa, the parents still derived joy from having her alive, even if Theresa might not be at all aware of her environment given the persistent vegetative state. Within the testimony, as part of the hypotheticals presented, Schindler family members stated that even if Theresa had told them of her intention to have artificial nutrition withdrawn, they would not do it. Throughout this painful and difficult trial, the family acknowledged that Theresa was in a diagnosed persistent vegetative state.


My take on all this is that the Schindlers are loving parents who don’t want their daughter to die. Michael is a loving husband who doesn’t want to see his wife forcefully kept alive against her will. (In the GAL report the GAL list four possibilities and one of them is a Johnny Got His Gun type in which the GAL hypothesizes she may be somewhat aware and unable to communicate and slowly going crazy trapped inside her own mind.) Since the only way to keep her alive is to demonize Michael, the Schindlers, a la mamma bears, are viciously attacking Michael. Kudos to him for staying out of that discussion and refusing to be drawn into it. I HIGHLY recommend reading this GAL report if you are at all intrigued by the case. It not only has the history, but also explains the law and the science. It is 38 pages, but has huge margins and double spacing and you can skip all the intro and legalese.
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DarrylParsons

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4 people die EVERY SECOND on planet Earth.

tick, tock, tick, tock,

that's another 40 people right there...

who mourns for them?
 
JudgeWapner

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Death is a part of life. I never view it as sad, just enevitable.
 
TheRightWing

TheRightWing

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Just sad as hell when you die there's an armed guard sitting next to your bedside just waiting to pounce on someone that might insert your feeding tube back in watching Peoples Court.

Ok so my understanding is that a few years back her hubby would sign over to her rights to her parents so what happen?They would be pulling her out without all these media vans around the hospital.....Or is this all about some insurance money who knows!!!

Bet living wills went up 75% since all this!
 
JudgeWapner

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RW, to tell you the truth, I'm still not sure what this is all about, or how it went so far. But you are dead right about living wills.
 
stucco43

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Open Letter to America On Terri Schiavo's Plight

From David Chu
Santa Rosa, CA
3-24-5


<TABLE height=85 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=553 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top width="601%" height=84><DL><DT>Dear America - <DT>[size=+1][/size] <DT>[size=+1]Up until today, I have been a dispassionate and passive observer in the life and death of Terri Schiavo, as most Americans have. I am not a citizen of this nation but I live and work here. As an outsider and foreigner looking in, I offer my perspective on this pivotal issue of whether Terri Schiavo lives or dies. As I write on March 23, the chance of Terri surviving much longer without her feeding tube being reinserted is quickly diminishing.[/size] <DT>[size=+1][/size] <DT>[size=+1]Let me state the facts and not the spins and half-truths of those who have a vested interest in the death of Terri Schiavo. Terri is a person who is not on life support and she is not a comatose patient kept alive by artificial or mechanical means. Terri is a disable person who requires food and water to survive--just as all of us do. But she needs extra help because she is disabled. Terri is capable of saying "Mommy" and "Help Me." Terri can breathe on her own. These irrefutable facts are not the signs of a "vegetable," "brain dead," or "comatose" person that the mainstream media keeps repeating over and over again as though their spin is reality. (ABC Caught: Schiavo Poll Distorted by Michelle Malkin)[/size] <DT>[size=+1][/size] <DT>[size=+1]Has over 30 years of Americans aborting their unwanted, unborn children so desensitized them that they can no longer determine right from wrong? Where is the compassion for the disabled? Will Terri's death be the starting point on that slippery sliding slope in the euthanasia of the disabled and unwanted people in America?[/size] <DT>[size=+1][/size] <DT>[size=+1]Has America become a giant football/reality show where people in the Red States think and believe one thing and those in the Blue States the other--neither sides seeking the truth? Have Americans become so brainwashed by the mainstream media and the two political parties that everything becomes a political football of whose side you are on? Not about what is the right thing to do in a particular situation? Not about what is the right thing to do in Terri Schiavo's plight?[/size] <DT>[size=+1][/size] <DT>[size=+1]Has the rule of law in America become so hollow and so brittle? Where is the "compassionate conservatism"? Where is the "bleeding heart liberalism"? Has the application of the laws in America become like those of Nazi Germany where the police and courts are just taking orders and following the law? Where will this end up?[/size] <DT>[size=+1][/size] <DT>[size=+1]Has the president of the greatest and most powerful nation on this planet become so impotent and so powerless as to not be able to save the life of one individual in America? Do we honestly believe that if Jenna or Barbara, the twin daughters of President Bush, were in the exact situation as Terri Schiavo is now that President Bush wouldn't "kick some butt"to save them?[/size] <DT>[size=+1][/size] <DT>[size=+1]Finally, have the American people forgotten the admonishment from Moses: "I have set before you life and death, blessing and curse; therefore choose life."[/size] <DT>[size=+1][/size] <DT>[size=+1]If Terri Schiavo dies at the hands of her husband and the court system of America, I am afraid that her death will mark the beginning of the end of America as that beacon of hope and freedom and liberty for this world. What a sad day that shall be.[/size] <DT>[size=+1][/size] <DT>[size=+1]Most regretfully yours,[/size] <DT>[size=+1][/size] <DT>[size=+1]David Chu
[/size]</DT></DL></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
 
DarrylParsons

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Good grief! This: the beginning of the end of America as that beacon of hope and freedom and liberty for this world.from 1 euthanasia case!? :WTF:


Judge,

Great attitude there...wish more of us had it :103631605
 

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