Bush calls out people for "lacking courage" and "frightening" the public

[cincy_]

Only this time, he's using his lines against people who are against his amnesty plan.

GLYNCO, GEORGIA -- President Bush attacked opponents of an immigration deal Tuesday, suggesting they "don't want to do what's right for America."

"The fundamental question is, will elected officials have the courage necessary to put a comprehensive immigration plan in place?" Bush said.
​

and then he accused them of trying to frighten the public:

"If you want to scare the American people, what you say is, the bill is an amnesty bill. It's not an amnesty bill. That's empty political rhetoric, trying to frighten our fellow citizens."
​

Seems like Iraq war lines are coming back in this campaign for amnesty ... COURAGE and SCARE TACTICS .... now if he could somehow say that anyone against amnesty isn't supporting the troops, this would be a bigger hit.

 

[Willie99]

"Will elected officials have the courage to put together a comprehensive plan"?

Damn, W sure is dumb. I see your point. After, nobody is playing politics with this issue. Nobody is using scare tactics to win support for their position, that would be 'unamerican".

How do you connect saying "people are using scare tactics" with the Iraq war again?

W used those words before going into Iraq? like we should'nt have been scared about going into Iraq or something?

:think2:

Do you have a link?

 

[Anti-liberal]

It's amazing. You oppose this illegal immigrant bill with logic and common sense and honest debate and you get called a "racist", "fear-monger" and "nativist". Fuck this. I've had it. I will never support any naturalization of illegals in this country for as long as I live.

1)BEEF UP SECURITY AT THE BORDER
2)GO AFTER EMPLOYERS THAT HIRE ILLEGALS
3)GO AFTER LANDLORDS THAT RENT TO ILLEGALS
4)DEPORT ILLEGALS WHO COMMIT CRIMES

Those four steps won't stop all illegal immigration, but they would get things going in the right direction. Under this new bill, we can't even deport illegal gang-members and Islamofacists that are here illegally. Total fuckin' joke. I'm against ANY immigration reform. Enforce the laws we have.

 

[cincy_]

How do you connect saying "people are using scare tactics" with the Iraq war again?

Never said Bushie used that phrase ...

He is just using the Iraq war lines on immigration:

• COURAGE to vote on a bill (pro-war GOP line)
• FRIGHTEN people against a bill (anti-war Liberal line)

So the next time people call others "peaceniks" or "defeatists", tell us which side of the immigration debate you're on ... because you might lack courage yourself.

 

[cincy_]

It's amazing. You oppose this illegal immigrant bill with logic and common sense and honest debate and you get called a "racist", "fear-monger" and "nativist".

Not so ... he just thinks you lack courage.

In other words, only little weasels like you and I oppose amnesty

 

[Anti-liberal]

Not so ... he just thinks you lack courage.

In other words, only little weasels like you and I oppose amnesty

It's one of the most insulting things I've ever heard coming from politicians. If opposing this shit bill means I lack courage, then color me a coward because this bill scares the living SHIT out of me. Something clicked in me on this, and I will vigorously oppose ANY immigration amnesty as long as I live. No more rewarding those who don't respect our laws. I don't care if we have 50 million illegals running around. No citizenship for these fucks. But if the anti-Americanism shown during the Miss Universe competition is any indication, these maggots will fit right in with the Democratic party.

 

[barman]

Save your hysteria for that moment in the next 20 years when the USA peacefully annexes Mexico and gives them congressional representation in Washington DC

Si Si

 

[Anti-liberal]

Save your hysteria for that moment in the next 20 years when the USA peacefully annexes Mexico and gives them congressional representation in Washington DC

Si Si

You're crazy if you think they want to join the U.S. THey're still pissed about losing the southwestern U.S. territory from Texas to California. Reconquista jargon is alive and well even today. They think Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, Nevada and California should still belong to them. Something tells me that these Mexican folks could never be counted on to "ASSIMULATE". NO SE PUEDE.

 

[Willie99]

Never said Bushie used that phrase ...

He is just using the Iraq war lines on immigration:

• COURAGE to vote on a bill (pro-war GOP line)
• FRIGHTEN people against a bill (anti-war Liberal line)

So the next time people call others "peaceniks" or "defeatists", tell us which side of the immigration debate you're on ... because you might lack courage yourself.

I have previously stated my position.

We absolutely need the Mexican workers

We are a country of immigrants and we should allow productive immigration to continue to grow our work force

We should implement a system that allows productive immigrants to become legal and enable new immigrants to enter legally

There must be a grandfather clause to be meaningful, and a drop dead date. After that, we must punish everyone that is not complying with the new laws, employers, immigrants, landlords and all others associated with any illegal activity.

After we make it easier for productive immigrants to enter this country, we must improve border security 10,000 %. Hopefully the illegal / unmanaged flow decreases making this job easier.

It's not perfect, but WTF is?

Kicking everybody out is simply not possible on many different levels.

 

[Anti-liberal]

I have previously stated my position.

We absolutely need the Mexican workers

We are a country of immigrants and we should allow productive immigration to continue to grow our work force

We should implement a system that allows productive immigrants to become legal and enable new immigrants to enter legally

"We absolutely need the (illegal) Mexican workers" For what???!!! I'm sick of hearing this bullshit. WTF do we need illegal workers for? I want to hear your reasons.

And Harriot, we already have system in place for productive immigrants to become legal. We've got foreigners with PhD's waiting in line to get into this country legally. Why not let them in, instead of the lawn maintenance crew?

 

[Anti-liberal]

...and Willie99...don't give me that bullshit reason that they'll do the jobs Americans won't do. I'll debunk it in about 2 seconds.

 

[Willie99]

...and Willie99...don't give me that bullshit reason that they'll do the jobs Americans won't do. I'll debunk it in about 2 seconds.

They're doing jobs that we don't have enough unemployed manpower labor to do.

Unemployment in this country is approx 5%, some of that is seasonal. Simple math to me, how many Mexicans are working in the States and how many americans are looking for work in that region?

Without the Mexican workforce, two bad things can actually happen. The local economies where they live and work will suffer and there will be inflationary pressure in all the industries in which they are employed.

equally important, it's not practicable to simply round up and deport millions and millions of people, that simply won't work.

It's not perfect AL, but there is no perfect plan known to mankind.

 

[Anti-liberal]

They're doing jobs that we don't have enough unemployed manpower labor to do.

Unemployment in this country is approx 5%, some of that is seasonal. Simple math to me, how many Mexicans are working in the States and how many americans are looking for work in that region?

Without the Mexican workforce, two bad things can actually happen. The local economies where they live and work will suffer and there will be inflationary pressure in all the industries in which they are employed.

equally important, it's not practicable to simply round up and deport millions and millions of people, that simply won't work.

It's not perfect AL, but there is no perfect plan known to mankind.

We don't have to round up illegals...just deport them when they commit crimes, and go after employers and landlords that deal with them. That's a start. And beef up security at the border. Giving 10 to 12 million illegals amnesty "simply won't work" either.

As far as the economic impact of losing the illegal immigrant work force...there may be short-term impact on local businesses who had a lack of forsight to build their business model around customers who are here illegally. That being said, there will be a positive impact in which the strain and hospital and other social services will be eased by reducing the number of illegal immigrants they are serving at the taxpayers expense.

Any short-term shortage in the labor force (with I don't believe will happen anyways) would be compensated for by the free market. Wages in occupations formerly dominated by illegals would have to rise (to attract workers to fill the jobs previously filled by illegals) until they reached an equilibrium with the supply of labor.

Illegals in the U.S. are serving no one but themselves and the ruling elite in the U.S. who get a maid out of it. The lower class has to compete with Illegal labor and therefore work for a lower wage. The middle class howdy: ) is being looted in taxes to deal with the strain on social services and law enforcement caused by illegals.

You didn't come with the "jobs Americans won't do", but you were close. Go to moveon.org for more pro-amnesty cliches.

 

[Willie99]

AL, we both can agree that we must do something. Hopefully, whatever passes will have teeth.

I just don't have much confidence in government anymore. It's all watered down.

and don't insult me with that Moveon.org stuff.

:nono5:

 

[Anti-liberal]

AL, we both can agree that we must do something. Hopefully, whatever passes will have teeth.

I just don't have much confidence in government anymore. It's all watered down.

What we must do is enforce our laws. I don't think we have to pass any new legislation....just enforce the laws we have now. We never really gave that a try. If any new laws are going to be passed, they should be laws that deter further illegal immigration. This "we'll give amnesty to 12 million people, THEN we'll enforce our laws and protect our borders" is 100% BULLSHIT!!! It'll be the destruction of this country. We'll end up just like your average socialist European entitlement country with $7.00 a gallon gas and a massive immigrant population which refuses to assimilate with the host country's population.

 

[Willie99]

What we must do is enforce our laws. I don't think we have to pass any new legislation....just enforce the laws we have now. We never really gave that a try. If any new laws are going to be passed, they should be laws that deter further illegal immigration. This "we'll give amnesty to 12 million people, THEN we'll enforce our laws and protect our borders" is 100% BULLSHIT!!! It'll be the destruction of this country. We'll end up just like your average socialist European entitlement country with $7.00 a gallon gas and a massive immigrant population which refuses to assimilate with the host country's population.

AL, since they're here already, I'm not sure them staying here will lead to the destruction of this country. I do support deportation of criminals and people otherwise abusing our system. I don't support the deportation of everyone. I also support increased border security, a substantial increase. If we don't tighten our borders and minimize illegal activities, that may lead to the destruction of our country.

I gotta admit, it feels weird being somewhat liberal on this issue. Then again, this debate seems to be flip flopping within both parties. Not really sure who stands for what anymore.

 

[cincy_]

I have previously stated my position.

It's not perfect, but WTF is?

Kicking everybody out is simply not possible on many different levels.

That is fine ... so when I get pulled over for a felony tonight, do I tell the cops that I HAVE TO go to work tomorrow, and that I have 36 students who REALLY need me to be there?

Have you seen Bushie's "penalty" for overstay? It is a joke.

It is like saying, "you fuckt me, I love you."

 

[Anti-liberal]

AL, since they're here already, I'm not sure them staying here will lead to the destruction of this country. I do support deportation of criminals and people otherwise abusing our system. I don't support the deportation of everyone. I also support increased border security, a substantial increase. If we don't tighten our borders and minimize illegal activities, that may lead to the destruction of our country.

I gotta admit, it feels weird being somewhat liberal on this issue. Then again, this debate seems to be flip flopping within both parties. Not really sure who stands for what anymore.

I'm not saying deport everyone. I'm saying deport criminals, and reduce the incentives for immigrating illegal to the U.S.

The reason "it feels weird being somewhat liberal on this isssue" is that you are not being true to your core beliefs. That weird feeling is your conscious tweaking you. If you give this matter more consideration, I think your take on it will change.

I've been very tame in slamming this illegal immigration movement. I haven't even scratched the surface on all the crime illegals are involved in and the strain they are putting on law enforcement.

 

[Anti-liberal]

Have you seen Bushie's "penalty" for overstay? It is a joke.

And the punchline is that not even the "penalty" will be enforced at the end of the day. If laws aren't being enforced now, why are we supposed to feel reassurred that they will be in the future? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!!! (again)

 

[cincy_]

I'm not saying deport everyone. I'm saying deport criminals, and reduce the incentives for immigrating illegal to the U.S.

Once you give these guys amnesty, there will be 10 million more in Mexico thinking, "Damn, just go to the US and wait it out Pablo... it might take a few years, but you'll be a US citizen ... "

... and make sure you bring a lot of your friends, cause once there are too many people to do anything about illegal immigraion, you will get the grand prize.