Here is what is wrong with all the proclamations about the Big East in line to get 6 or 7 teams in the tournament and ACC only 4 – If any of the Big East teams (including the top Uconn, BC, Syracuse, Pitt) had to play NC, WF and Duke 2x this year, they would have 5 or 6 losses. The Big East ‘powers' have weak non-conference schedules, and after fattening up on them they come into league play undefeated and nationally ranked. Then they split their games with each other, but pick up wins playing Seton Hall, St. John’s and the bottom teams. If you look at the teams with 8-10 wins in the Big East, show me a legit non-conference win from any of them. Villanova at home against Kansas? OK. There is ONE. Look at Pitt – what is their best non-conference win? At home vs. Memphis, when Memphis was a .500 club? I hear the media hype the fact that BigEast is 6-1 vs ACC this year. Besides the fact that most of those games were on BigEast home courts, none of them involved a top half ACC team, except one. Of course it was the one loss for the Big East, NC at UConn.
I don't think anyone is disputing that the ACC is a better conference than the Big East, overall. But that doesn't mean the Big East teams aren't in the same class as the ACC. The Big East will probably send 7. The RPIs are high enough where it is possible, though G-Town tripped on its shoe lace today.
UNC would rule whether it is the Big East or ACC. After UNC, the ACC and the Big East stack up very evenly in my opinion.
UNC would rule whether it is the Big East or ACC. After UNC, the ACC and the Big East stack up very evenly in my opinion.
ACC bias
Thats why there alot of money to make in march.....gotta love the inflated ACC lines. Syracuse lose 5 out of 6? Crazy statement. Watch out for BC too. underrated. I'll give Uconn as down this year. But I can even see Nova and Pitt in the sweet 16. This kind of stuff makes for a great month though. Nice post
Thats why there alot of money to make in march.....gotta love the inflated ACC lines. Syracuse lose 5 out of 6? Crazy statement. Watch out for BC too. underrated. I'll give Uconn as down this year. But I can even see Nova and Pitt in the sweet 16. This kind of stuff makes for a great month though. Nice post
What's funny is that Va Tech, and Miami were bottom feeders in the Big East...
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR vAlign=top align=middle><TD width="2%"></TD><TD width="49%"><TABLE cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=2 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR class=bg1 align=middle><TD class=bg1 colSpan=4>Atlantic Coast</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD class=bg1 align=left>Team</TD><TD class=bg1 align=middle>Conf. W-L</TD><TD class=bg1 align=middle>Tot. W-L</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>North Carolina</TD><TD align=middle>10-2</TD><TD align=middle>22-3</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Wake Forest</TD><TD align=middle>10-3</TD><TD align=middle>22-4</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Duke</TD><TD align=middle>9-4</TD><TD align=middle>19-4</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Maryland</TD><TD align=middle>7-6</TD><TD align=middle>16-8</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Virginia Tech</TD><TD align=middle>7-6</TD><TD align=middle>14-10</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Georgia Tech</TD><TD align=middle>6-6</TD><TD align=middle>15-8</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Miami (Fla.)</TD><TD align=middle>6-7</TD><TD align=middle>15-9</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>North Carolina State</TD><TD align=middle>5-7</TD><TD align=middle>15-10</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Virginia</TD><TD align=middle>4-9</TD><TD align=middle>13-11</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Florida State</TD><TD align=middle>3-9</TD><TD align=middle>11-15</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Clemson</TD><TD align=middle>2-10</TD><TD align=middle>12-13</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
and The Big East, not the ACC, has the last two national champions.
The Big East has seven Sweet 16 teams the past two years. The ACC has three.
The ACC sent two teams (Duke and Georgia Tech) to the Final Four last year. Big East beast Connecticut beat them both on its way to the national title.
If recent tournament history isn't convincing enough, maybe the best argument for Big East supremacy comes from the epicenter of the ACC, where Big East defectors Virginia Tech and Miami are more than holding their own.
In their own arrogance and ignorance, the ACC coaches picked Virginia Tech and Miami to fight for last place in the league...But these two Big East busts already have combined for 13 ACC wins this season.
So come tourney time watch out for the Big East!!!<!-- / message -->
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR vAlign=top align=middle><TD width="2%"></TD><TD width="49%"><TABLE cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=2 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR class=bg1 align=middle><TD class=bg1 colSpan=4>Atlantic Coast</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD class=bg1 align=left>Team</TD><TD class=bg1 align=middle>Conf. W-L</TD><TD class=bg1 align=middle>Tot. W-L</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>North Carolina</TD><TD align=middle>10-2</TD><TD align=middle>22-3</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Wake Forest</TD><TD align=middle>10-3</TD><TD align=middle>22-4</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Duke</TD><TD align=middle>9-4</TD><TD align=middle>19-4</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Maryland</TD><TD align=middle>7-6</TD><TD align=middle>16-8</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Virginia Tech</TD><TD align=middle>7-6</TD><TD align=middle>14-10</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Georgia Tech</TD><TD align=middle>6-6</TD><TD align=middle>15-8</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Miami (Fla.)</TD><TD align=middle>6-7</TD><TD align=middle>15-9</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>North Carolina State</TD><TD align=middle>5-7</TD><TD align=middle>15-10</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Virginia</TD><TD align=middle>4-9</TD><TD align=middle>13-11</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Florida State</TD><TD align=middle>3-9</TD><TD align=middle>11-15</TD></TR><TR class=bg2 vAlign=center align=right height=17><TD align=left>Clemson</TD><TD align=middle>2-10</TD><TD align=middle>12-13</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
and The Big East, not the ACC, has the last two national champions.
The Big East has seven Sweet 16 teams the past two years. The ACC has three.
The ACC sent two teams (Duke and Georgia Tech) to the Final Four last year. Big East beast Connecticut beat them both on its way to the national title.
If recent tournament history isn't convincing enough, maybe the best argument for Big East supremacy comes from the epicenter of the ACC, where Big East defectors Virginia Tech and Miami are more than holding their own.
In their own arrogance and ignorance, the ACC coaches picked Virginia Tech and Miami to fight for last place in the league...But these two Big East busts already have combined for 13 ACC wins this season.
So come tourney time watch out for the Big East!!!<!-- / message -->
I'l admit I am somewhat biased , I think Duke 102 Wake Forest 92 is a better game than BC 65 Syracuse 60 anyday of the week. If the Big East sends 7 teams it's a joke. Any of the ACC's bubble teams would easily be a top Big East team., I just don't see penalizing teams like Miami or Georgia Tech who might get 6 losses against the ACC's big 3 and then reward Big East teams who get their 'quality' wins beating each other.
Southpaw said:
Where are the Orange quality wins? the one at Villanova? I give them credit for at least playing Ok St (lost by 14) early in they year when the rest of the Big East was playing their cupcakes so they could start Big East play 10 -0
Syracuse has lost 4 of their last 6 games, I think it would be safe to say they would struggle at Duke, NC or Wake. They would hold their own against the rest of the ACC which would put them about equal to Georgia Tech. Of course everyone says GT is a bubble team but Syracuse is a tourney LOCK b/c they are still ranked in the top 10 for some reason.
919 said:
So you are saying that teams should be judged THIS YEAR on what they did in the past? That is what is wrong with this picture - UConn, Syracuse and Pitt have been ranked all year based on what they did last year or before. As a result of the inflated ranking, teams like Pitt can lose at home to Bucknell and still stay in the top 20. Then at the end of the year, they can point to their wins over each other and say look at these quality wins over ranked teams. This was Georgetown's MO for many years, schedule St. Leo's and go 13-0 then try to go .500 in the conference and say look we have 20 wins.
Pitt's non-conference schedule was weak, I am not going to attempt to argue otherwise. Just wanted to point out that Memphis was a neutral site game(coaches vs cancer) not a home game as you said. Pitt has stayed in the top 20 not because of an inflated ranking but because they are 8-4 in the Big East including sweeping Syracuse and winning at UConn.
My response to this as a Big East fan and supporter is that I heard the same crap about the Big East last year and the year before that and in both cases, you know who won the NCAA Championship? (hint - not Duke, Wake, NC, etc.) The Big East bottom teams are better than the ACC bottom teams and head to head the Big East leads the ACC this season. 102-92. Did they play that game on a playground last night? There is more to basketball than shooting and offense. That is why come tourney time, the Big East fares well.
My response to this as a Big East fan and supporter is that I heard the same crap about the Big East last year and the year before that and in both cases, you know who won the NCAA Championship? (hint - not Duke, Wake, NC, etc.) The Big East bottom teams are better than the ACC bottom teams and head to head the Big East leads the ACC this season. 102-92. Did they play that game on a playground last night? There is more to basketball than shooting and offense. That is why come tourney time, the Big East fares well.
Black & Gold said:
If you look at the PRI ratings 10 of the 11 ACC teams are in the top 100. Only Floridat St, which has lost about 10 games this year by a point (similar to BigEast's Providence) is at 135.
The Big east has 8 of their 12 teams in the top 100. I think this year the Big East is definitely weaker at the bottom. As far as the head to head, it would be nice to see the top half teams playing, I think the UConn-NC game was the only one where that happened.
I agree Big East teams do well traditionally in the tournament. But I am saying this year, to say they deserve 7 teams when their top half gets to play 4 conference teams out of the top 100, plus their easy non-conference schedules to pad their win totals is not right. Maybe the top half of the Big East is more evenly matched than the Acc's but from top to bottom, I think that outside of Florida St, there are no ACC teams home courts where you go and expect to win without your A game
It is a good debate for sure. I just think the ACC is so overly pumped by guys like Dick Vitale, etc. and I personally don't care for the style of play too much so I always love an ACC/Big East debate. Here is the thing with the Big East schedule & potential tourney bids - Pitt, UConn, Syracuse, and ND all play each other twice, BC, NOVA, G-town only play these teams once. All but ND are in for sure. I think ND needs to split versus Pitt and UConn coming up and take care of UCLA & Rutgers at home to seal a bid. They still may swing it with a win the conf tourney. BC obviously in. NOVA has #9 SOS & 15 RPI so barring a collapse, they have certainly earned a berth as well. Georgetown is sqarely on the bubble as far as I'm concerned. Looks like 6 teams in the Big East with ND & Georgetown scrapping for the last bid. As for the ACC, it looks like 5 teams to me - NC, Wake, Duke, Maryland, & G-Tech. V-tech may be making a run at it but Miami actually may be a better long shot due to a better RPI. Big East has 12 teams and wil probably get 6 teams. ACC has 11 teams and will probably get 5. Seems pretty fair to me.
I personally liked what Illinois did to Wake Forest. FOr the ACCers who didn't like it, expect more of it in the tourney as Illini don't have to travel at all. Kind of like when Duke plays at Winston-Salem every other year.
Problem for Duke is they haven't played UNC twice yet, but everyone is griping about their seeding. I say beat Va Tech twice and it will help.
I think mid-level teams like Villanova and Notre Dame are just as good if not better than Maryland and G -Tech.
Problem for Duke is they haven't played UNC twice yet, but everyone is griping about their seeding. I say beat Va Tech twice and it will help.
I think mid-level teams like Villanova and Notre Dame are just as good if not better than Maryland and G -Tech.
