After a Touchdown I thought....

[Tulsa]

that the PAT/two-point conversion was a no-time, required play at all levels of football? Someone tell me what's up. Am I just wrong? tulsa

<TABLE class=tablehead id=playTable cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=3><TBODY><TR class=evenrow vAlign=top><TD noWrap colSpan=2>3rd and 4 at PSU 10</TD><TD>Chad Henne pass incomplete to Steve Breaston.</TD><TD> </TD><TD> </TD></TR><TR class=oddrow vAlign=top><TD noWrap colSpan=2>4th and 4 at PSU 10</TD><TD>Timeout MICHIGAN, clock 00:01.</TD><TD> </TD><TD> </TD></TR><TR class=evenrow vAlign=top><TD noWrap colSpan=2>4th and 4 at PSU 10</TD><TD>Chad Henne pass complete to Mario Manningha for 10 yards for a TOUCHDOWN.</TD><TD class=bi align=middle>25</TD><TD class=bi align=middle>27</TD></TR><TR class=oddrow vAlign=top><TD colSpan=2> </TD><TD>End of 4th Quarter

</TD><TD> </TD><TD> </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

 

[Dante]

your right Tulsa...but the REF had the +3 so no kick

 

[100KbyXMAS]

It's required only if the defense demands it.

 

[scottw]

It is ALWAYS required in the NFL, but not college.

 

[hellah10]

it doesnt matter anyways....they woulda never kicked it.....they woulda went under center, snapped the ball and kneed it

 

[Tulsa]

It is ALWAYS required in the NFL, but not college.

except for sudden death overtime, of course...

 

[Tulsa]

It's required only if the defense demands it.

If you are correct about this, then shouldn't the defense have demanded it? There is always an opportunity for a muffed snap or somesuch...right? Is it not true that the defense can score on a PAT/two point conversion or am I wrong about that? Can't they return a PAT? No? Now that I think about it....I just don't know. Someone help me here. tulsa

 

[Insiders]

No snap needed. College is NOT required to kick or try extra point conversion
They could care less about the margin of victory as a W is a W.

 

[hellah10]

im pretty sure that in NCAA, if you block a PAT or the other team gets an INT on a 2-pointer....its a dead ball and they cant advance it - unlike the NFL

 

[Tulsa]

im pretty sure that in NCAA, if you block a PAT or the other team gets an INT on a 2-pointer....its a dead ball and they cant advance it - unlike the NFL

Well, I think you're hellah right and that is just hellah cool. So there was no reason to have the PAT/2-point conversion attempted.

Insiders, there are rules that don't involve gambling even in pro football! Most NFL rules aren't concerned about the margin of victory and a W is a W too (I can't think of any rules that are concerned with the margin of victory.) In fact, sudden death in the NFL leads to field goals and wins that have screwed me way too often. Actually, college ball and the way they handle 'overtime' actually helps the fellow who had the favorite much more than the NFL sudden death does. tulsa

 

[100KbyXMAS]

im pretty sure that in NCAA, if you block a PAT or the other team gets an INT on a 2-pointer....its a dead ball and they cant advance it - unlike the NFL

you got it reversed.

 

[100KbyXMAS]

Instead of all this mental masturbation, who doesn't anyone bother to just look up the rule?

SECTION 3. Try Down
How Scored
ARTICLE 1. The point or points shall be scored according to the point values
in Rule 8-1-1 if the try results in what would be a touchdown, safety
(Exception: Rule 8-3-4-a) or field goal under rules governing play at other
times (A.R. 8-3-1-I-III; A.R. 8-3-2-I-III, V and VIII; and A.R. 10-1-7-XII-XXI).
Opportunity to Score
ARTICLE 2. A try is an opportunity for either team to score one or two
points while the game clock is stopped and is a special interval in a game
which, for purposes of penalty enforcement only, includes both a down
and the “ready’’ period that precedes it.
a. The ball shall be put in play by the team that scored a six-point touchdown.
If a touchdown is scored during a down in which time in the
fourth period expires, the try is mandatory unless the team behind in
the score leaves the field of play.

there is more if you wish to read on.

http://www.ncaa.org/library/rules/2005/2005_football_rules.pdf


So yes, Penn St could have made Michigan run a "try", and MIchigan would have taken a knee and ended the game. Has anyone every seen a fumbled snap while trying to take a knee? And, has anyone ever seen that fumble returned for a TD? Maybe, Paterno didn't know the rule, but most likely he was just being realistic and showing good sportsmanship.

 

[THECLOSER]

that sucked

 

[ElJefe]

Speaking of extra points messing up covers, does anyone remember that game Pete Carroll coached with the Patriots years ago where they beat the Bills on with a touchdown on the last play? The Bills left the field in disgust and he had the Pats run it in for 2 points giving them a 4 point win to cover the 3 1/2 point spread. That had to be one of the worst beats ever if you bet the Bills.<!-- / message -->

 

[mws]

Thanks for the definitive answer, 100K.

 

[AlwaysKeen]

so Carroll's been doing this for a while then eh?...I never see them kick it in college, especially at the end of a close game...

 

[Tulsa]

Speaking of extra points messing up covers, does anyone remember that game Pete Carroll coached with the Patriots years ago where they beat the Bills on with a touchdown on the last play? The Bills left the field in disgust and he had the Pats run it in for 2 points giving them a 4 point win to cover the 3 1/2 point spread. That had to be one of the worst beats ever if you bet the Bills.<!-- / message -->

That is a good story. Oddly, I didn't get kicked by that one, thank God. tulsa

 

[Tulsa]

Instead of all this mental masturbation, who doesn't anyone bother to just look up the rule?

1.) mental masturbation is a stress release

2.) we knew you would look it up

Thanks for posting that. One last thought...it looks like the defense can only score one or two points on the take-away; not a touchdown. What is funny is the thought of the team picking up a turnover running the length of the field and setting up a quick point kick....LOL! That is one thing we will never see. But two points for the D can occur if I read that excerpt correctly. Thanks again 100K. tulsa

 

[100KbyXMAS]

1.) mental masturbation is a stress release

2.) we knew you would look it up

Thanks for posting that. One last thought...it looks like the defense can only score one or two points on the take-away; not a touchdown. What is funny is the thought of the team picking up a turnover running the length of the field and setting up a quick point kick....LOL! That is one thing we will never see. But two points for the D can occur if I read that excerpt correctly. Thanks again 100K. tulsa

No problem,

Yes, only 2 pts could be scored by the defense. (unless they did the old drop-kick field goal that Jim Thorpe and co. used to do in the 20's.)

 

[hellah10]

No problem,

Yes, only 2 pts could be scored by the defense. (unless they did the old drop-kick field goal that Jim Thorpe and co. used to do in the 20's.)

your absolutely correct...

Western Michigan did it to Ball St (the 5OT game) couple Saturdays ago and against Temple the Saturday before that....so they've blocked 2 PATs and ran both back for 2 pointers...

good call xmas